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FAQs About Sump/Filters Pumps/Plumbing/Circulation 2
Related FAQs:
Sump Pumps/Plumbing/Circulation 1,
Sump Pumps/Pb/Circ 3, Refugium
Pumps/Circulation 1, &
Sumps/Filters 1, Sumps/Filters 2,
Sumps 3, Sumps 4,
Sumps 5, Sumps 6,
Sumps 7,Sumps 8,
Sumps 9,
Sumps 10, Rationale,
Design, Construction,
Sump Components, Maintenance,
Refugiums, Plenums in Reef Filtration,
Marine System Plumbing, Holes
& Drilling 1, Durso Standpipes,
Overflow Boxes, Bubble Trouble,
Plumbing Noise, Make Up Water
Systems,
Marine Aquarium Set-Up, Algal Filtration
in General, Mud Filtration 1,
Related Articles:
Pressure Locking Sump Baffles; Welcome to the World of Versatility!
By Joshua McMillen,
Refugiums,
Marine Filtration, Reef Filtration,
Mechanical, Physical,
Plumbing Marine Systems by Bob Fenner,
Myth of the One Inch Beast
(Why Relying on One Inch Overflows... or Overflow! Is foolhardy)
by Scott Vallembois,
Fish-Only Marine Set-up,
FOWLR/Fish and Invertebrate Systems, Reef
Systems, Coldwater Systems,
Small Systems, Large Systems,
Refugiums, | 
Might that certain someone crawl out/into your plumbing lines, hmmm?
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Plumbing question, sump 12/13/07 Hello, <Hello
Jeff.> I hope all is well with the WWM crew! <It is on my end,
trying to spread Christmas cheer.> I just purchased a used 72 gal bow
front. I am trying to get the plumbing worked out and have a few
questions. There is a 20 gallon long sump. I have a quiet one 4000
return pump stepped down to 3/4 inch with a ball valve for my return. It
has about 4 ft vertical head with 1 90 degree elbow. I used the reef
central calculator and get 587 gph as my return rate. My overflow is
just shy of 1 inch id, 9/10" as far as I can tell. The bulk head has a
barbed connector for flexible PVC so it robs a tiny bit of diameter.
<OK> I am trying to figure out how much flow the overflow can handle.
I tried dumping water down the overflow and timing the gallons for a
minute and I got a flow rate of 240. 4 gallons in 1 minute = 240
gph. I read somewhere in the FAQ that I should get around 300 gph for a
1 inch overflow. Is this the max? <Yes, 240 for this set up sounds
reasonable.> I am using a Durso as well. I had the return pump
running full blast for several hours and the tank did not overflow so I
can not figure out how the overflow can keep up if it only handles 240
gph out but the return is blasting 587 back in. <The pump is likely
not actually flowing this amount. Calculators tend to be overly
optimistic. Is there an intermittent flushing/slurping noise? Overflows
can flow more than specified by creating a siphon, but this cannot be
trusted.> I want to add another pump and plumb it up the back of the
tank and then T it off to make 3 outflows along the back instead of
power heads. I would like to run this pump from the sump as well but I
don’t know if the overflow can handle it and I don’t want a mess on the
floor. <The overflow will not handle this.> Is there some error
in my calculations? If not should the tank already be overflowing?
<If you flow the bulkhead at its absolute limit you will likely end up
with water on the floor sooner or later. It becomes a balancing act that
you will eventually lose.> Will I be able to add the pump, I am
thinking another quite one 4000, to the sump or will I have to draw the
water from the display? <Definitely intake from the display.> I am
trying to get as close to 1400 gph turnover as I can. I am planning this
tank as a soft coral with fish display. I have a 30 gallon FOWLR now
but it is not drilled and have no sump. This is my first plumbing
project. Thanks for all your help and for your great site. I spend 2 or
3 hours a day reading through it for the past several months steady
planning this. Kind Regards, Jeff <Great to hear, keep reading.
There is a wealth of knowledge available. Welcome, best wishes, Scott
V.>
Question Regarding Two-Pump Sump And Refugium Return Setup – 12/13/07
Hi, <<Hello>> I can't seem to find an answer to this question in
your website and I'm wondering if you can help me. <<I shall
certainly try>> I have a 110 gallon FOWLR with a wet/dry sump and an
Eheim Hobby 1262 return pump (900gph) that is currently running.
<<Okay>> I'm planning to add another sump just for refugium (live
rocks and macro algae) and use my Mag-Drive (1200gph). <<Mmm…>>
Would there be any problem if both sumps (with different pump speed) are
running separately into the same tank?? <<Even though you have not
provided any information re your plumbing scheme (Number/size of drains,
how these vessels will be “fed” from the tank), I recommend you do NOT
try this… Even if the drains are sized appropriately for the flow rates,
you will have great difficulty/an impossible task keeping the flow
regulated for the individual pumps (and before you ask…no…valves on the
drain lines are not the answer). What is most likely to happen is the
flow will equalize between the overflows causing one pump to starve and
one pump to not keep up (overflow the vessel). Even if you use
dissimilar drain diameters, the smaller will be overwhelmed and
surge…with the resultant noise and bubbles. Nor is utilizing two pumps
of the same flow/manufacture going to work as differences in
head-pressure caused by subtle differences in plumbing, even differences
in the rate of buildup of bio-film within the plumbing, will still keep
the flow from being exactly the same between the two. Your best option
is to plumb the refugium to gravity-drain in to the pump chamber of the
sump (fed by one of the drains). And there’s no reason you can’t put
both pumps here (the sump) if you wish to have the extra flow…assuming
your drains can handle the total output, which for the two pumps you
have listed I recommend three – 1/1/2” drains OR two – 2” drains
…minimum…>> Thank you in advance for your response. Regards,
Miguel <<Happy to share Miguel… Do write back if what I have stated
is not clear or you wish to discuss further. EricR>>
Flow through sump, des. – 10/28/07 Crew, Thank you in
advance. <Scott V, glad to be here with you.> I came across
something that I had not considered before today and want to run it by
you. I'm setting up my 240g with 100g sump. I've done some testing with
my return pump and it's giving me about 2400 gph with my current
manifold configuration. I have four 1.5" drains along the back wall.
<Nice big tank with big sump. Good safety margin on overflow size vs.
flow.> Seeing how I do not want powerheads or a CL, this 10X turnover
is about right for my planned inhabitants. My only concern is that 100%
of this will be through my sump. I am not concerned with the noise
aspect of this set up as everything, sans display, will be a through
wall set up in the garage. Today I read something about in sump skimmer
inefficiency with too much flow through the sump. (I have Euro-Reef
RS250) Have you heard of this? Should I be concerned? What exactly are
they talking about? Have I overlooked any other drawbacks to this volume
through the sump? Any advice is appreciated! Thanks, Ben <The
ideal setup would have just enough water coming through the overflow as
the skimmer can process, the overflow would skim a thin layer of surface
water and it would flow directly into the skimmer. This will give you
the highest concentration of the organics you want your skimmer to
remove and theoretically give you the highest efficiency per pass (these
same compounds your skimmer removes are the most concentrated on
surface). The issue you are reading about is the fact that too much flow
will dilute that surface water, thus your skimmer sees less of these
organics per gallon, technically being less efficient per pass. The flow
through the sump and its effect on the skimmer performance is a matter
of optimizing, not necessity. Fact of the matter is you have a lot of
carrying capacity with your tank, you add to that a large sump and you
picked out a awesome skimmer that will still perform great. Have fun,
sounds like a nice setup, Scott V.>
Sump/Overflow Question…Best Way To Temper Flow? – 09/01/07 Good
morning all, <<Greetings Daryl…evening now>> Thank you again for
the world of info on your website. <<A collaborative effort…we hope
you find it useful>> I hope this finds you well. <<Doing fine,
thank you>> I recently moved my 55-gallon FOWLR to a 75-gallon
aquarium with an overflow. In the 55 I was using a canister filter and
skimmer; the 75 is my first venture with a sump. <<A worthwhile
change/upgrade>> I am currently using my CPR hang-on skimmer with the
75, planning on eventually using a skimmer in the sump instead. <<Ah
good…perhaps one from my current fave, Euro-Reef>> The sump is a
Megaflow 2, which is sized for a 75-gallon aquarium; my return pump is
rated at 950 gal/hr. Sump intake is through a 1 1/4" hose and is output
through a 3/4" hose connected to the pump (not split). My question is
this: The volume of water coming into the sump tends to overflow the
prefilter pad daily; I rinse or change the pad, which quiets things down
for awhile, but in about 24 hours I am back to overflowing the pad.
<<Perhaps a coarser pad would not clog to quickly>> The water in the
overflow bubble chamber is approximately 3/4" above the prefilter tray,
which seems (to me) a bit much. <<Why, what problem is this
causing?>> What is the best way to lessen the water coming in to the
sump? <<Reduce the volume of water being pumped up to the tank>>
Am I better off installing a valve on the intake to lessen the flow into
the sump, or would I be better off splitting the return to the tank?
<<Don’t place a valve on the drain line, but rather, install a
“gate-valve” on the “output” side of the pump to temper flow as needed>>
My guess is that splitting the return would be a better option, as I
would also increase water movement with a second output, but I would
very much appreciate your opinion. <<You can split the return if you
wish…but do still install the valve for best “control” of the flow
rate>> Thank you in advance for all your help. <<Happy to assist>>
All good wishes, Daryl <<And to you in kind. EricR>>
Re: Sump/Overflow Question…Best Way To Temper Flow? – 09/03/07
Sorry to bother again...very quick follow up: <<Hey Daryl! No bother
mate>> I have a check-valve on the output of my pump. <<Is a
mistake to use/rely on these devices in my opinion. Much better to
design/install plumbing such that the sump will handle all transient
water volume. The check-valve imparts significant resistance requiring a
larger pump (and associated cost/energy consumption) than normal, and
will most assuredly fail at some point>> If I install a gate-valve,
should it go inline before or after the check valve? I would assume the
gate-valve would come first, followed by the check-valve... <<This
might be fine (If you are determined to keep the check-valve). Though
depending on the size/type of valve and how much you need to reduce
flow, you may find that the valve stops all flow before the desired rate
is reached if the gate-valve is installed first. This is probably of
little concern, but a bit of experimentation will tell>> Thank you
again, and all good wishes, Daryl <<Happy to help. EricR>>
Some General Questions On Sump/Closed-Loop Plumbing – 07/03/07
Hi. <<Hello>> I was wondering if you could please answer a few
quick questions regarding plumbing. <<Sure…ask away!>> I am
setting up a 135-gallon reef with 55-gallon sump. <<Very nice>>
Currently the tank has 4-holes drilled in the upper back glass panel
that fit 1-inch bulkheads. <<Okay>> I'm planning on using all 4 as
overflows out of the tank. <<Do figure only about 300gph per…still,
1200gph is a LOT of flow to process through the sump (if that is your
plan)>> I was planning on plumbing 2 of the overflows down into the
sump where an Iwaki rxt30 <<I think you mean the 30RLXT?>> (19
gallons/minute at 0 head) will return the water back into the tank
(approximately 5-feet head). <<Be sure to plumb a “gate-valve” on the
output side of the pump to allow tempering of the flow if necessary>>
The other 2 overflows I planned on incorporating into a closed-loop
system with another pump similar to the Iwaki with similar flow rate (I
don't have it yet). <<Ah! Excellent…but you really only need one of
these throughputs for this purpose>> Would the two 1-inch overflows
per pump be sufficient to minimize sucking and gurgling noise, or should
I plumb all 4 overflows down into the sump, forget about the closed-loop
and use some powerheads instead? <<If you keep the flow rate for the
sump drains in the range I suggested you will likely be fine, although
even then sometimes a bit of tweaking (aspirating the lines,
experimenting with different configurations of the termination ends,
etc.) can be necessary due to the vagaries of system design. As for the
closed-loop, a single throughput directly plumbed will be enough to
supply the pump (the fluid dynamics are different than those associated
with “gravity” drains). You could use the last bulkhead to supply the
sump and be even further ahead of the game…or even use it to supply an
in-line refugium>> Or even a third option: use 3 overflows for the
sump and 1 for a closed-loop with a smaller pump? <<You can do this
with you current planned pump. Unless there is something about your
design that will restrict the water volume (e.g. – bushing “down” the
pipe size), as long as you match the bulkhead/pipe diameter to the
intake port on the intended pump you should be fine>> What size (flow
rate) pump would work ok with a 1-inch overflow to minimized gurgling
and sucking noise? <<As explained…unless the throughputs are
positioned very close to the surface where a very strong pump/flow rate
may create some cavitation. But again, be sure to plumb a gate-valve on
the output side of the pump>> Also, on the return plumbing from the
sump (and closed-loop if there will be one) should I reduce the 1-inch
return pipe just before it enters the tank after the T, or should the
two pipes putting water into the tank remain 1-inch (the output on the
pump is 1-inch)? <<Reducing the diameter as you indicate often makes
the return easier to handle/place/disguise, but will also reduce
flow/add to head pressure…as will that “T” you mentioned. All the more
reason to slightly oversize your pumps and adjust flow with the
gate-valve if needed. For the closed-loop, to will need to reduce the
terminal ends/nozzles to ½” to achieve a useable velocity…and then
likely no more than two of these (for closed-loop applications figure
about 350 – 400 gph per ½” nozzle)>> Lastly, should the bulkheads be
slip or thread on the outside of the tank portion? <<Is up to you>>
I want thread so they can easily be removed just in case, but am worried
about leaks. <<I wrap my threaded fittings with several layers of
Teflon tape…or you could smear some silicone sealant on the threads just
before assembly and let it cure before use (this doesn’t “glue” the
joint but does help greatly with creating a drip-proof seal>> Your
expert opinion would be greatly appreciated here. <<Mmm, don’t
consider myself an expert…but prefer to think of myself as a “student”
of the hobby>> Thank you Jon <<A pleasure to assist. EricR>>
Sump pump calculation 4/25/07 I'm planning for a 375g
tank. I want to have a 75g sump/refugium with a Euro Reef RC500
skimmer. It says it comes with 3 Eheims 1262 pumps. It's rated at
634gph. <Okay...> I used the sump and pump calculator and it
comes out to 375gph for 5 times over. <Mmm... but you won't get
this flow rate... with these pumps, at this head height, through the
plumbing... likely more like half this> Do I need to get a
bigger sump? I may be able to fit a 100g but it still calculates
to 500gph. Is there a way to slow it down or do I just have to live
with the higher turn over rate? <Mmm, are a few ways... I see
you have gate valves on the discharge side in your graphic...> I
wanted to keep the pumps outside the sump but I can save space
and make the sump bigger if I put the pumps in. Will it be quieter?
<These pumps are very quiet> Will it heat the water more?
<To have the pumps in the water? Yes> I have to have the sump
in the stand. I was thinking of using 1.5" return and overflow
pipes since the RC500 has a 1.5" outlet size. The calculator comes
out to about 5ft of head loss with 150gph flow rate for each
side. The Eheims 1262 looks like it will pump 700gph with 5ft head
loss. I want to have two pumps, one for each return that will
split into two. Can I just slow it down or is it better to go with
smaller pumps? The next size smaller will pump 640gph together.
Thanks.
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a232/pikherchu/Aquarium/AquariumLayout13.jpg
<I would set all up as per your graphic, fire over and see what you
think... I don't believe you will have a problem here... But you'll
want to (very likely) add other circulation... Perhaps Hydor or
Tunze internal pumps... maybe a separate closed-loop with an
external pump... Bob Fenner> |
Re: Sump pump calculation 4/27/07 Thanks, I will go with
two Eheims 1262 for the return pumps to match the same pumps on
the skimmer. I guess I read it wrong but the website says the
max pump output is 900gph, Max Delivery Head: 11'6". <Mmm,
yes... this is the stated stat.s... In actuality, magnetic
driven pumps "lose" a good deal of pressure/volume-flow in
actual application... particularly with any "turns"...> I
can always turn it down like you said. <Yes... but
likely unnecessary here> Another question, for the refugium
I was thinking of adding a 24" PFO LED light fixture. Should I
go with the 13,000K or 20,000K? <Lower temp. preferred>
I want to prevent heat since it's in the stand and possibly save
a little electricity. BTW, I know it was hard to read the
diagram since I couldn't figure out how to save the PowerPoint
in high resolution but I do have a Tunze Turbelle Stream Kit
TS24 and also Tunze 7400/2 powerhead for the return. <Very
nice units> Also since this is like the hundredth email I
sent, let me know if you want Macadamia nuts or something. I
live in Hawaii and I can ship it to you. <Heeee! Just came
back from the Big Island yesterday (and am out in Toronto
visiting today... some frequent flyer miles now!), but do
appreciated the offer... Mahalo for your kokua. Bob Fenner> | 
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Regulating The Flow Through My Sump/Refugium – 03/09/07 Hi,
<<Hello>> I just have a question regarding the flow rate through my
sump/refugium; I’ve done a lot of reading on WWM but can’t find the
answer I’m looking for. (sorry if I’ve missed it). <<No
worries...let’s see if I can help>> I’m just about to start building
my sump tank, the first chamber shall house the skimmer, the second will
be the fuge and then the return, the whole sump tank is roughly 25
gallons so the fuge shall hold roughly 13 gallons. The skimmer shall be
gravity fed with a “T” junction before the skimmer taking excess water
from the overflow (which can handle 2400 litres per hour) into the
refugium. <<Ok...roughly 630 gph, for us colonials [grins]>>
Obviously the water from the skimmer also will flow into the fuge.
<<Yes>> After a little research I’ve read that the flow through the
refugium should be very low, (max 10x the fuge volume). <<Depends
really...a bare bottom refugium with Chaetomorpha macro-algae would
likely be fine...but yes...generally, flow rates are 3-10 times the
volume of the vessel>> The way I have first planned (above) means
that all the water coming from the overflow would go through the fuge
(2400 litres per hour) which I now know is a lot. The problem I have is
that I want to use as much flow as possible to help with turnover but at
the same time keep the flow through the fuge down. <<I suggest you
give it a try and see how it goes>> I did think to bypass the fuge
(from the overflow and skimmer) to the return chamber and “T” off the
return pipe with a ball-valve and have some water redirected into the
fuge but I still have water from my skimmer going into the fuge which
will be around 800 litres an hour. <<And is a mere 210 gph...should
do nicely in my opinion>> Would this be the best way to achieve this
or am I missing something? <<Not “missing” anything, I think this
will be fine>> I hope that all makes sense. <<It does>>
Thanks. Leo <<Quite welcome, EricR>> Sump Flow Rates
and Powerhead Opinions - 2/20/07 Hello. <Hey
Pam, JustinN with you today.> I've been combing your Q&A's looking
for the answer, but haven't found it yet. <Ok> I'm
getting conflicting advice from my LFS who seems very knowledgeable, and
also from one of the most highly regarded forums...also seemingly very
knowledgeable reef-keepers. <Often is just a difference of
methodology, not necessarily one whom is right or wrong.> I'm buying
a my first tank and have been doing a ton of research (books, online
forums, LFS) <Excellent, this is the starting point of a successful
hobbyist for certain.> I'm buying a 54g corner tank, with a Oceanic
Micro Sump (approximately 15g...only thing that will fit in the stand).
<Sounds good> My LFS recommends a Eheim 1260 return pump in the sump
(flow is 635gph which is about 11 times my display size) plus 1
power-head in the display, and the reefers on the forum, recommend the
smaller Eheim 1250 (317gph which is about 5.8 x my display size) with 2
power-heads in the display. They're saying the 635gph through a 15g
sump will be too much flow through the small sump, causing lots of noise
and micro-bubbles. <I would agree with the fellow reefers here, my
friend. You could likely come up with a baffling system to negate a deal
of the micro bubbles, but chances are you will always be competing with
them from that flow, to some extent. Also, there's the factor of having
to match your overflow rate to the sump, with the return pump -- at
higher flow rates, can be harder to do.> I know from reading lots of
your Q&A's, that you are anti power-heads in the display, but do you
think the 635gph will be too much going through a 15g sump? If it's
not too much, will that be adequate flow without any power-head in the
display at all? Your points regarding powerheads definitely make sense.
Thanks so much! Pam <I would not say that we are anti-powerheads
here, on the opposite side of the coin, I think that we are for the
right solution for each individual tank, to which there is no steadfast
rule, or specifics. Powerheads are very effective for their purpose, and
can be utilized without great issue here. If you wanted to eliminate the
powerheads in your tank though, do consider having another overflow and
return plumbed into the tank. You could create a 'closed loop' here,
utilizing a pump such as the Eheim 1260 and bypassing any excess
filtration methods, just draining water from the tank into the pump
system, and returning its flow to the tank itself. Both methods will
serve your purpose just fine, my friend. Keep up the research, and
welcome to the hobby! -JustinN> Sump Questions, des.
2/19/07 Hi Crew, <Hello> My current setup is a 30 long
display tank with 30lbs of live rock, 2 Aquaclear 50 powerheads (turning
the water about 18x), sponge filter, so I am ready for quarantine, Prizm
skimmer (I know these skimmer aren't the best). <In my opinion, they
are a good skimmer for smaller tanks such as you have.>
There are no fish in the system yet, just Turbo snails, Nassarius
snails, Red Striped Hermits, and tons of copepods. It is my first
saltwater tank and it matured very quickly due to the 100% cured live
rock from my LFS. My only regret is I wish I had bought a larger tank.
<Always best to go with the largest system you can afford.> I am
thinking about adding another 30-gallon long aquarium and converting it
into a sump/refugium underneath <Whoa, if you should lose your
siphon, you will pumping more water into the display tank than it can
hold.> to really increase the copepod population and filter
nitrates. The reason I want my sump/refugium so
large is because I will probably be upgrading to a much larger tank as
soon as my 30 gal display is full, and my thinking is that if I go ahead
and setup a 30 gal sump/refugium now, I won't have to setup a new one
for a larger tank when I buy it. Here's where I am getting stuck, by
reading the refugium FAQ's I have determined that the flow through the
refugium should be around 3-6x. I can accomplish this with an Eheim 1048
(about 150gph) but I cannot find an overflow box rated lower than
300gph, which is almost twice the flow of the Eheim 1048. What should I
do here? <Tee off the return line to feed the refugium.> The
design of the sump/refugium would have the overflow box feeding into a
skimming chamber, where I will incorporate the skimmer, bubble trap
going into the second chamber that contains the refugium, baffle going
into the return chamber. I've got the design preliminarily worked out,
but how do I figure out how large the return chamber should be? I want
to maximize refugium space but not at the cost making the return chamber
too small. <Here is a link that will give you formulas to all your
questions.
http://www.reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php Look at the left sidebar,
a list of calculators available is listed. James (Salty Dog)>
Re: Sump and Return Pump Questions 2/14/07 Thanks for
your prompt response. I have a couple of additional questions. I'm not
great at math, so I would like to know if there is a way to determine
how many gallons will drain from the (2) 1 1/2" overflows versus how
much flow I will get from an Iwaki 100RLT (or one of the quieter models
you mentioned....what pump would you recommend?). <Mmm, there are
useful approximations... much can/does affect such... issues of added
plumbing, horizontal runs in particular... There is a semi-useful
"calculator" posted on Reefcentral.com... In practical applications,
providing for excess... occlusion... is wise. Our collective evaluations
of pump choice are posted... here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marsetupindex2.htm Do you see the
links?> How much of a turnover would you recommend? <... also
posted...> I will be creating the reef with walls on the ends and an
open swimming area in the middle. Would I be better with 4 returns
versus 2? <More than less> I will drain each
overflow separately. Concerning the refugium in the sump, would you
recommend that I place a piece of Plexiglas with a few holes in it so
reduce the flow rate through the refugium? <Actually
another bypass arrangement would be better... again...> Do you have
any additional suggestions? <Heeeee! You're not joking I take it...
sorry, just struck me as humorous> Would you recommend any
wavemaking devices? <Mmm, no... more gimmick than of use in most
(small) hobbyist set-ups> I would prefer not to add powerheads
because I used to have a 150 gallon reef and every time I used a
powerhead, it would run for a day or two, then the motor would burn up.
<There are better quality units... Look into Tunze here...> I
sincerely appreciate your feedback. I would much rather get things
right PRIOR to establishing the tank. It will be much easier to do
things right the first time than to correct them later. Thanks again.
<Am in total agreement... Read... the Net, books, perhaps conferring
with other hobbyists... a club? A guru there? BobF> Scott Sump
Flow/Return Pump Selection - 12/07/06 I would like to add a sump
to my tank and take off the canister filter. <<A fine idea>> I'm
a little hesitant, due to the so called "flooding" in a power outage.
<<Easily managed/avoided with careful placement/positioning of
overflow/return plumbing>> My question is regarding the return pump.
<<Ok>> My setup would be as follows for a 75 gallon FOWLR tank:
2 - Continuous siphon overflows (due to a non-drilled tank). <<The
redundancy is smart planning>> 600 gph w/1" outlets & 100 gph
Venturi lift pumps. <<I would only plan/expect to flow about 300-350
gph through a 1" overflow>> 1 - 12x12x24 tank for the sump divided
into three compartments. 1st for the AquaC Remora Pro skimmer,
heater & Chemi-Pure. 2nd for some live sand and rock with a compact
light. 3rd for the return pump (here's were I am not sure). My
pump has to pump more than 1200 gph? <<Mmm, no...the two 1"
overflows will only handle about 700 gph combined before they become
very noisy/a hassle to "tune">> Do you prefer one kind over another?
<<I generally prefer a "submersible" pump for reasons of noise
attenuation>> Could you recommend one? <<For your setup I would
probably use a MagDrive 9.5 with a gate-valve installed on the output
side of the pump to temper the flow as needed>> I want to make sure
I get the right pump the first time and not get one that might be under
or over powerful. <<I think the MagDrive (with installed gate-valve)
would serve you well>> Your help would be most appreciated. <<Is
my pleasure to assist>> Would you recommend a spray bar, power head,
or just the return flow on the end of the return lines? <<You
"could" use a spray bar along the upper-back of the tank, but I would
probably just adjust/position the outlet pipe near the surface (to
preclude back-siphoning too much water when the power is off) and
pushing water along the length of the tank. You could then position a
powerhead on the opposite end facing the pump return for some random
turbulent flow>> If using one of the above, would I need the use of
additional powerheads for circulation in the tank? <<Additional flow
is almost always beneficial>> Maybe one or two on the bottom?
<<Wouldn't hurt>> Thanks in advance for your advice. <<You're
quite welcome>> I think your site is wonderful and I've learned a
great deal in such a short amount of time. <<Thank you...is a
collaborative effort>> I would love to get your book. <<Bob has
several, but 'The Conscientious Marine Aquarist' is a great addition to
any marine hobbyist’s library>> Dawn <<Regards, EricR>>
Sump/refugium 11/24/06 Hello, <Hi there>
I have a question regarding a sump/refugium. I have
researched the site but haven't found any information on exactly what I
would like to do. I currently have a 55g with 55lbs of LR. I have a
2.5in sand bed and I am slowly adding to it to increase the depth to
acceptable DSB levels. I have 2 Seio M620's and 2 MaxiJet 600's for
powerheads, a Remora Pro, 1 blue damsel, 2 percula clowns. I have
decided to add a sump/refugium before adding more livestock but they
both have to be upstream. Here is my question. I purchased a 29g tank
and I was originally thinking that I would divide the tank in half. I
would put a 6" DSB, LR, and Chaetomorpha in the left half of the tank
drawing water from the main tank through a mini jet 404. (I have tested
this and I can get almost the full range it says on the box. I don't
have to pump up more than 8 in.) This would gravity feed through a 1"
bulkhead back to the tank. The other half would be the sump where I
would store the Remora Pro, heaters, activated carbon at times, and a
Magnum HOT at times, with baffles to reduce micro-bubbles. I was
thinking of a sock filter or something to catch larger stuff from
entering the chamber. <Best to situate/place this on/over a fitting
inside the first chamber line on the inside... fed by the
pump/powerhead> I would also use a pump to draw from the display
tank and a gravity feed back through a 1" bulkhead. <?... as a
totally separate process I take it... a "return manifold" to use the
parlance. NOT in association with this upstream refugium> I have
read that a 1" bulkhead is realistically good for 200gph. I will figure
out what size pump to buy for that but here is my question. Would it be
better to design the sump/refugium like I explained above so that the
fuge and sump are fed separately at different flow rates or would it be
better to incorporate the fuge into the sump using 1 pump and 1 gravity
feed back to the display? <This latter... one pump... not two here>
Your site is incredible and filled with an unbelievable amount of good
information. There would be many aquarists who would have given up if
it wasn't for your website and the time your crew has spent in answering
questions. Thank You Paul Kelly <A pleasure to serve, help
you in your successes. Bob Fenner> Small Bubbles from Sump Return
Pipe – 11/01/06 Hi Eric, <<Hey Ken>> I have an annoying
dilemma. <<Uh-oh>> Would you have an opinion as to what is
causing small bubbles coming out of my return pipe into my tank?
<<Sure...I have opinions on most anything <grin>. It is likely you
either have a very small plumbing leak that is “sucking” air...or the
return pump is pulling bubbles from somewhere in the sump>> It has
been like this since the first day. <<A very common issue>> I
was told last week by someone that it was probably because it was new
sea water in the tank. <<...!? I don’t think so>> However it is
still occurring. As you know my tank is a 90-gallon AGA mega-flow tank
which has the internal skimmer box. <<Yes>> I put saltwater in
it 8 days ago. 6 days ago I added about 120 lbs of live rock. I have a
48” MTC Beckett style skimmer coming off the other side of my sump which
has two baffles. <<Have you checked to ensure the baffles are
keeping bubbles away from the return pump?>> When I look closely at
the return to tank side of the sump, I really don’t see any bubbles to
speak of so I do not think that this is the reason. <<Ah...ok>>
Also when I shut the pump off and turn it back on, a lot of large
bubbles come out of the pipe going into the tank. <<When the pump is
off the return line drains, yes? The “large bubbles” would be the air
that is pushed back out the pipe when the pump is turned back on>>
Is there air in the system? <<Possibly from a small (pinhole) leak
at a connection/union>> The water flow from my sump to my tank is as
follows: ¾” pvc flex tubing into ¾” union >>> Blueline 40 pump >>>
3/4” flex tubing >>> bushing to increase to 1”>>> 1” ball valve >>> 1”
union >>>1” ball valve >>> Bushing to decrease to ¾” >>> ¾” PVC >>> two
90 degree ell’s into my chiller >>> two 90 degree ell’s from my chiller
>>> ¾” flex PVC into the bottom of the tank for the return. <<Lots
of joints...you need to check each one of these (that is “out of water”)
to determine if one is “leaking” air in to the system. You can smear
Vaseline around each joint, though this must be “cleaned carefully” to
keep the petroleum component from deteriorating the plastic (Bob does
not recommend this method), or you can get a silicone grease for doing
this. Seal each joint one at a time, waiting a few minutes each time to
see if the bubbles stop>> The other problem (and maybe related) is
that when I put my hand in front of the return line into the tank, I
hardly feel any flow. The Blueline pump is rated at 790 gph @ 5’
head. I used a head loss calculator and I should have at least 560 gph.
<<Did you also take in to account the turns/valves in the
plumbing? Each 90-degree ell adds a foot to the head height, and I
would also add a foot for each ball valve in the line...the unions and
the chiller will be adding some additional resistance to flow as
well All in all, you will likely find the pump is less adequate than
you thought for this installation>> I am not sure what that feels
like against my hand, but it has to be more than what it seems.
<<Only way to know for sure is to direct the output in to a container of
known capacity and time how long it takes to fill>> I appreciate at
any idea someone may have. <<Hope I’ve given you a few>> Thanks,
Ken <<Regards, EricR>> Re: Small Bubbles from Sump Return Pipe
– 11/01/06 Hi Eric, <<Hello Ken>> Thanks for the quick
reply. <<Welcome>> When I get home tonight I am going to
shut-off the skimmer and see if that is the culprit or not. <<cool>>
With regards to your other idea (pin hole leaks etc), I need to re-do
some of the plumbing as I exchanged my chiller and I will have the new
skimmer on Friday. I think I will just re-do all the piping instead of
playing detective. <<Okay>> Is there any problem with gluing PVC
and then running the system with the live rock? Any toxicity issues?
<<Give the solvent an hour to cure and you’ll be fine>> I used a
head-loss calculator when I came up with my numbers. <<So you
mentioned...>> It asks how many feet vertical/horizontal. Number of
valves, unions, 90's, 45's, etc. It also lists all of the pumps that
are used. Pretty neat calculator. <<Sounds like it...if it is
accurate <grin> >> I guess I have to get out my 3 gallon bucket, and
see how long it takes to fill, and then multiply by 20. <<Mmm, not
sure I follow... I would time how long it takes to fill the bucket,
divide that number in to 60 (minutes in an hour), and multiply that
number by 3 (capacity of the bucket). The result should be the GPH of
the pump with the current plumbing configuration>> By the way, I
ended up with an H&S A150 - 2001. I heard H&S is supposed to be good.
<<As have I. I have seen this make of skimmer in action and it was
impressive...it also looked to be well made/engineered>> It is
similar to the Deltec AP-600 but rated a little larger than the
Deltec. In your opinion do you think this should be more than enough
for a 90 reef? <<Should be more than adequate>> Thanks, Ken
<<Cheers, EricR>>
Major Micro-Bubbles in the
Sump – 10/23/06 I have a micro-bubble problem that has kept me
up late at night for the past two weeks trying to solve! I have
narrowed down my source of the bubbles to the water draining into my
sump. <<Not uncommon...often caused by trying to “maximize” flow>>
My system is a 215G aquarium which I purchased with just the factory
drain holes. I'm only trying to push about 700GPH combined through
these holes with the use of two submersed Mag-Drive 7's. <<I see,
but how large are these throughputs...how many? Have you “measured” the
flow from the pumps or is this a guess?>> My sump consists of two
30G Rubbermaid containers joined a few inches from the top by two
bulkheads. I have four other containers cut out at the bottoms and tops
to act as baffles. Water enters from the drains by two separate pipes
(1 pipe for each overflow drain) and into the skimmer container on one
side of the first 30G container, and exits by the pumps from the totally
opposite end of the 2nd 30G container, this is a good 4 1/2 ft of
travel. <<Hmm...makes me think bubbles generated from the tank
drains is not the issue here>> I have managed to cut out 97% of the
bubbles that appear to be in the first container from reaching the pump
intakes. However that extra 3% is a good number of bubbles that I would
love stop reaching my display, and I can see them just being
pushed along the baffles and getting drawn down into the pump intakes.
<<Interesting...I would think with a good baffle system; and considering
the distance of travel/the relatively slow water flow, that the bubbles
would be easily dispersed. I wonder if there is any other equipment
along the way that could be generating more bubbles? Maybe the
skimmer?>> I'm thinking that I need to reduce the number of bubbles
that escape the very first container, it is approximately 12”x14” and
12" deep and I can hardly see the bottom due to the number of bubbles.
<<Ahh, okay...wow...that is a LOT of bubbles! Sounds like you have a
major air entrainment problem>> I have a plan to perhaps take out
this container so that water is entering into the next container which
is a good bit larger. <<From what you describe I don’t think this is
the best plan of attack>> I'm thinking I would have room to build a
manifold system similar to those built for aquarium returns but have the
water drain into it where it can be slowly released from a number of
smaller exits as opposed to just the two 1" pipes. <<Not sure I
follow this...but a series of “over-under” baffles in the first
container should have been able to deal with many of the bubbles>>
Do you see any potential problems with doing this? <<Not
“problems”...just don’t see it resolving your issue if you have as many
bubbles as indicated> Do you suppose it would work? <<Dunno>>
I can't figure out why it wouldn't but I don't want to build this thing
if someone else can quickly tell me why it would fail. <<Can’t do
that without better “detail” of what you plan. But try this...throttle
back the flow from the pumps and see if the bubbles decrease
significantly. Measure your true flow to the tank (time the filling of
a container of known size) and adjust to about 300 gph per each 1” drain
(175 gph for ¾” drains). Most drain calculators/schedules will tell you
these drains can handle twice this flow, but it is my opinion/experience
that reducing by half is much more practical/less problematic to deal
with and the flow will still be quite ample for the sump. Also, make
sure your drains are all absolutely at the same height. If one is a bit
lower than the other the flow through this can be significantly higher;
causing the excessive bubbles. If flow is not the issue, then look in
to aspirating the drain lines and/or adding an ell to the termination
point of the line in the sump. The former will help release entrained
air in the drain lines while the latter helps to guide bubbles away so
they don’t rise back in to the line blocking flow/creating more
turbulence>> Thanks, Kevin <<Happy to assist. Eric Russell>>
Sump/Manifold Plumbing - 09/13/06 Hi again folks. <<Howdy
Jim!>> I am smack in the middle of setting up my new 150XH reef (I
know, it's a tall tank, but there were reasons), with a 40G Breeder
sump/refugium. <<Cool!>> This was a very hurried job after my
72G bowfront sprung a major leak, <<Yikes! Been there myself mate>>
but now that the fish and corals are all (relatively) happily settled in
their new home (instead of Rubbermaid tubs in the middle of the living
room floor), I am considering how to redo the current temporary plumbing
into something more permanent and helpful. <<Okay>> The tank is
a predrilled/overflow tank from Perfecto, with one corner overflow (I
had anticipated two) which has a drain and a return fit with 1.25"
bulkhead fittings. <<Mmm...better than the usual 1" I suppose>>
My original plan was to run the 1.25" drain through a bushing, down to
1", and directly into the input of my Poseidon2 Vortex Venturi skimmer
sitting in the first 9" compartment of the sump, probably without even
using a pump--just let gravity drive the skimmer. Assuming I manage to
achieve the right flow rate, which, based on the pump that came with the
skimmer, should be 700-800 GPH, does this make sense, or is it a crazy
idea? <<You will never achieve 700-800 gph with a 1" (bushed)
gravity drain my friend...expect something closer to 400 gph. But from
what I can tell from a quick scan of the NET, this skimmer is not a
"recirculating" and thus won't work by simply feeding water to the
skimmer body. This skimmer needs to pull water from the sump through
the venturi pump to operate properly>> I was hoping this would
assure 100% skimming of the incoming water, but I can just run the drain
into the compartment and use the Via Aqua pump that came with the
skimmer to drive it, if that makes more sense. <<This is what you
will have to do>> Then through triple baffles/bubble trap (the idea
for movable compression baffles was a huge help) into a 20"x18"x12"
lighted refugium compartment with live rock, DSB, and macro-algae, then
into a 7" return compartment with a MAG-12 return pump and a float valve
for automatic make-up water. <<Sound fine>> I was then planning
to run the output of the MAG-12 into a SCWD (by way of a union and a
ball valve), and run one side of the SCWD into the pre-drilled return,
adding an over-the-wall 3/4" adjustable return at the other end of the
tank to achieve some random/surge circulation. <<I would use BOTH
throughputs to feed the sump...one "may not" handle the flow from the
MAG-12...at least not quietly>> I was then also planning to add a
couple small powerhead driven circulation devices in the back, using a
design I found on Reef Central that uses PVC to keep the powerhead up
out of the tank and in the canopy where it doesn't add heat and can be
maintained (strainer and PVC up to the powerhead, then PVC back down to
the location where circulation is desired). <Hmm...have not seen
this...>> Now that I've done some reading about plumbing on the
site, I am questioning the entire plan. <<...?>> First, I am
wondering if this would be enough circulation. I figure the MAG-12
should be pushing about 900 GPH at 6' head. <<Will be quite less
after the SCWD...but still possibly more than the single return will
handle efficiently/quietly>> Adding a couple 200 GPH auxiliary
circulation devices would bring my total to 1300, or 6-7 turnovers per
hour. Given what I have read, that doesn't sound like a lot.
<<Maybe go with some 400 vs. 200 gph powerheads>> Of course, I know
it's important to consider what I am keeping, which is all LPS, mostly
Euphylliids, Caulastrea, and various brains and Fungiids, none of which
particularly like very strong current, correct? <<Not really...they
will appreciate some good flow...but not being directly blasted. It
will likely take some finesse on your part>> Furthermore, it sounds
like the SCWD would seriously reduce the flow rate of my return, and I
don't think I want that. <<Indeed...maybe as much as 20%>> But
the present, single laminar return is definitely not working. I was
considering running my return into a manifold, but it sounds like the
return wouldn't begin to have enough flow to drive a decent manifold, so
I would need to install a second, closed loop system. <<Agreed>>
I don't have any intention of taking the tank down to drill additional
holes, so would it be possible to run a closed loop manifold without
drilling? <<I wouldn't>> An internally positioned pump?
<<Love those Tunze Stream pumps>> I can't imagine an overflow would
work to drive a manifold! <<Not recommended>> How can I achieve
decent, non-laminar flow with the present tank system? Any advice will
be appreciated! <<Why not use a "smaller" return pump (returned over
the top) and use one throughput for the sump drain, and the other
throughput to feed a closed-loop?>> Jim Jensen <<Regards,
EricR>> Pump choice for sump 8/19/06
Hello Crew, I am setting up a 180 gallon FOWLR system. The tank has
two internal overflows each capable of handling 2000gph. <...
really? These would have to be a minimum of two inch internal
diameter...> I will be running the plumbing into the wall at the
base of the wall, running it across my basement ceiling aprox. 50 feet,
and dropping it down aprox 3 feet into a 50 gallon sump by a sink in the
washroom. <Mmm... trouble with the "run" here horizontally, and the
transit volume/sump ratio... need a larger reservoir, big plumbing for
allowing for water in play> My question is, if this were your
setup, would you go with 1 or 2 pumps, I am a little concerned about the
noise level of two, and what would be your choice of pump ? Thanks.
<One good pump... if you have funds for this, a back-up copy should
there be trouble with the first. Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_3/cav3i2/External_Pumps/External_Pumps.htm
and the linked files below. I'd go with a Baldor-motored Sequence series
pump here. I've installed hundreds of these around the world...
dependable. Bob Fenner> Re: pump choice for sump
8/20/06 Hello Bob, <Devin... scape> I guess that the
manufacturer was exaggerating a little bit. The bulk heads that they
supplied are 1 1/4 and 3/4 ID. <... not surprising> So now I am
wondering what exactly the overflows can handle . <A few hundred GPH
maximum... there are a few factors to take into account, but likely
2-300 per... you can/could "bench test"...> This obviously will also
change the sump size required. Is a 50 gallon still too small ?
<Yes... the transit volume, the water in play... will overwhelm this
should the power, pump fail... Can/should be tested for as well, and the
sump marked with a "Maximum" water line... not filled beyond this mark.>
And I was estimating the run at 50 feet, rounding up for "good measure"
. After reading your reply I took out the tape measure and it is
actually 35 feet. Is the run still too long ? Thank God you guys are
here to help us amateurs. <Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/plumbingmarart.htm and here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/overfloboxfaqs.htm and the linked
files above... Educate yourself... you'll soon know... Bob Fenner>
Closed-Loop...No Manifold - 06/12/06 Hi Crew - <<Hello!>>
Need some advice please. <<I'll see what I can do...>> After
reading the FAQs on circulation I have decided to install a closed-loop
system w/o manifold on my 92 gal corner FOWLR. <<Okay>> I have a
decent amount of circulation with out it - about 12X. I think that's OK
for a FOWLR but just want the extra flow and had extra parts, e.g.-
pumps, etc. <<I see>> I plan to use a Quiet One 4000 pump and a
3/4-inch Sea Swirl wave maker. My intake would be the intake tubing
from an old canister filter. <<Mmm, as in a siphon tube? Is this
large enough? Should be the same diameter is the intake port on the
pump>> Because of space limitations I would like to place the pump
in the sump with my return pump. It will still be a closed-loop since
my intake will take water from my display and will return it through my
Sea Swirl powered by CL pump. Plus if the pump leaks it will be in the
sump. <<Agreed>> Are there any draw backs to this approach,
e.g.- increased bubbles? <<As long as you don't have a loose/leaky
joints air bubbles shouldn't be a problem, but starving the pump
(too-small input line) may cause issues>> Will I still get the
minimum head loss associated with closed-loops? <<At least, yes>>
Finally does it really matter if I use Spa Flex, i.e.- Flexible PVC of
flexible tubing instead of regular PVC? <<For the application you
describe...should be fine>> Thanks in advance for any insight.
<<Welcome, EricR>> Plumbing Setup for New 135
6/10/06 Hello Crew, <Scott> I sent a question a
while back and did not get a response, so I thought I would re-send in
case it did not get through. <Thank you> I am about to purchase
a new tank and was hoping to get some advice from you folks before I
made a big mistake specifying hole sizes and locations! <Okay>
The new setup is a 135 gal acrylic with a Ecosystem 3612 mud filter
(with a rated flow through the system of 1000-1200 GPH). Based on advice
from this website (which is an awesome reference tool!) I would like to
be able to recirculate a higher flow (about 2200 gph) but the maximum
allowable flow through the system is limited by the mud filter.
<Yes. Best/better not to exceed this flow rate... if you want more
movement... bypass this filter with it> Powerheads are an option to
get the additional circulation but I would prefer not to use them, if
possible. <Agreed> (FYI - Overflow system is sized for 200%
flow (in case one somehow plugs) <Good> - I am planning to use
two 15"x 5" trapezoidal pre-filters, each equipped with Durso standpipes
and 1-1/2" ID drains.) <All-right... may want to aspirate these
just the same... to reduce gurgling noise...> My LFS store where I
am planning to purchase the tank suggested using the internal overflows
as a "sump" for a separate (parallel) 1100-1200 gph recirculation loop.
In other words, cut a 1" hole about halfway down the back of the tank
behind each overflow, then feed a separate pump which returns to the
display. <Good idea> I can't find this flow scheme anywhere
in WWM and really don't have the experience to evaluate this - would you
please advise your thoughts? <Just another sump... perhaps best
serviced by one of the two overflows... and these better up-sized to two
inch inside diameter... but tying the two... mud and non-mud sumps
together with an equalizer line to prevent flooding> Also, my
current thinking is to run the return connections through the back of
the tank at three locations - near the top of the tank next to the
overflow boxes. Does this sound OK or would you run the returns through
the overflow boxes? <I'd fun these either very near the top/back
or over the top itself... equidistant from the sides... with nozzles on
them to direct flow> Lastly, I thought it might be a good idea to
locate one or two of the returns lower in the tank, say behind the LR,
to improve agitation - good idea or just another location for leaks?
<I would NOT do this... if the pump/s fail, even with check valves in
place, this could be a disaster> Thanks in advance for your reply.
Scott <Glad to proffer it. Bob Fenner> Re: Plumbing Setup
for New 135 6/11/06 Hello Bob, <Scott>
Thanks again for taking time to comment on my new 135 gallon set-up. I
appreciate your comments and will definitely incorporate them into the
design. I was however a bit confused about your
suggestion to "tie the mud sump and non-mud sump together". Just to be
sure that I communicated this to you properly, please allow me to
clarify as follows. <Let's see... what I'm suggesting is a
pipe-line connecting these two sumps (that in turn would hopefully be
about at the same level), to allow for a possible, likely real
difference in overflow/return to each... An "equalizer" of sorts that
would prevent too much water from going to or returning from either sump
system...> Regarding the second (non-mud filter) recirculation
loop, my LFS guy suggests using the overflow box (or boxes) as the sump
<?> for the second pump. The reasoning used is that there will
always be a water column in the overflow boxes due to the use of the
Durso standpipes. <Mmm, not useful here... this pipe will have
air mixed in... if you're referring to drawing water from the sump
itself, this will work> Does the above suggestion have merit or do
I need to utilize a separate sump (same level as the mud sump with an
equalizer line between the two) as you described? <Mmm, if you're
considering a "closed (pressurized) loop" separate from the sump
(second), I would drill another through-put for its sole intake use. I
would NOT run/drain water for this device through a non-water-filled
overflow line. Bob Fenner> Best regards,
Scott
Re: Overflow rates ... and... sump plumbing period
- 04/19/06 Again thanks for taking the time to answer my
questions. <Yikes... if pertinent, pls include prev. corr. We have
no way of easily tracing who you were chatting with, about...> I
have a 55 gal. reef that I am setting up a 10 gal. refugium (small I
know but necessary due to space constraints, and I figure some is better
than none). I have a CPR overflow box that is rated at 600 Gph. It
comes with a 1.250 bulkhead fitting. I want to use flex tubing for the
drain line to the Ref. What size pump should I use for the return?
<... a "small one"... Providing perhaps three to five times turn over
maximum... a need to be cautious here due to the small size of the sump
itself... the real possibility of it overflowing with transit volume
should the pump fail> Should I put in some kind of valve in order to
help balance the overflow with the return? <A good idea... though
better if the pump were "about right" w/o valving> Can I just
install the overflow w/1.250 flex tube and a clamp and run it to the
refugium and then .625 or .750 flex from the pump back to the tank?
Thanks. <Mmm, yes. Over-the top... I do encourage you to read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/refugium.htm Particularly the linked
files at top on Design, pumps/plumbing... Bob Fenner> Jay W. Thom
Set-Up/Water Flow 04/17/2006 Hi Guys and Gals <Hello
Ian> I have spent many enjoyable hours reading the FAQs yet trying
to find a definitive answer to my specific question has alluded me so
far. All I want assurance on is whether I have the correct number and
size of pipe entering and leaving my tank. It will be a 2500litre
tank (roughly 600g?) with a 600litre sump. I plan to have 4x 50mm
overflows cut into the back of the tank leading directly to the sump. A
28000lph pump with various tee offs en route ( frag, chiller,
refugium,) will hopefully deliver about 20000lph back to the tank by
way of 1x 50mm pipe split into 2x 50mm at the inflows. I will also
have 2x 18000lph closed loop systems each with a 50mm exit from back of
tank and returning with 4x32mm to various points in the tank. All the
50mm exits are at a similar level which is just below the full water
level. Should I have a 50mm emergency overflow above this level
leading to sump? I am not sure if I will/can even have an overflow
problem with this setup and the only place I was planning on having one
was from my sump to drain to accommodate my water changes. <Sump
should be sized correctly to avoid overflow problems. I have posted a
link with all sorts of useful calculators to help you configure your
system correctly.
http://www.reefcentral.com/calc/sump.php> Have I missed anything
here? I take it that the closed loops will not drop the water level.
<No.> How critical is the positioning of the exit holes to sump relative
to the closed loop exits? <Not critical, just keep holes a safe
distance from each other to avoid weakening the acrylic, no less than
six inches from hole edge to hole edge. Better yet is to have the tank
builder set this up for you.> Thanks in advance for any input you
may have. <You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)> Cheers Ian
Sump Plumbing Confusion - 04/01/06 Hello, <<Hi!>> I'm
sorry I couldn't find my answer anywhere (I think everyone else is so
beyond me!). <<!>> I have spent months trying to get everything
just right for my new 90 gal. reef tank and I am finally ready to go
(thanks to "the Conscientious Marine Aquarist" , "Reef Invertebrates"
and your website). <<Excellent!>> My problem is that everything
has been a learning experience and now I am afraid to add the water!
<<Really?>> How do I fill the tank? <<?>> I am scared it
will just overflow the sump. I have read everything here about keeping
the water at certain levels but I have no clue how to do that. <<Ah,
I think I understand now...>> I have a Megaflow #3 sump with a PM
bullet 1 inside with a Sedra 9000 pump. My tank is a pre-drilled 90
gal. all plumbed to sump with a Mag 9.5 return pump. <<Hopefully you
have at least two 1" overflow drains?>> Quarantine is in basement
ready to go. I'm afraid my question is so ridiculous but I had to ask,
it could make or break the weekend! <<No worries Jill...fill your
tank and then fill your sump to just cover the pump housings. Turn on
your pumps and add more water to the sump as necessary to keep the pumps
from sucking air. Now, turn off your return pump and watch to make sure
the sump does not overflow. If all was sized/installed/positioned
correctly, the sump should be able to hold the transient water volume
from the tank when the pump is off. Next, with the return pump still
off, turn off your skimmer pump and make sure the sump can handle this
volume as well. At this point, if all is well, you can add water to
bring up the level in the sump for the added volume/evaporation
capacity. This will be the maximum amount of water your system can hold
when the power is off. If you your sump won't hold the transient water
volume from your tank then you have issues. You will likely need to
change/adjust the height of the overflows but I'm only guessing at this
point as I know nothing much about your setup. Hopefully this will be
helpful to you but if you are still having problems/don't understand do
please write back in and we'll get it figured out together. Don't want
to spoil the weekend! <G> >> Thanks so much, Jill <<You're
quite welcome. Regards, EricR>>
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