The Call of The Wild...(The Ethics of Collecting Your Own Specimens)   7/2/07
Hello everyone!
<Hey there! Scott F. in today!>
Let me first tell you that we have been reading and loving your web site for several years. We have learned SO much and managed to "re-identify" many items we've purchased from our LFS. Thank you so much for allowing the average hobbyist access to your vast knowledge of this very rewarding hobby. I have been able to locate practically EVERYTHING I have ever needed to know on your site.
<I know what you mean! I found a really great recipe for meat loaf the other day, and a step-by-step guide to mastering the yoyo, right here on the WWM site! Wow! In all seriousness- thanks for the kind words. WWM is one of the best sites of its kind on the 'net! There are a lot of really talented people here who put their best into this site each and every day. Glad you enjoy it as much as we enjoy bringing it to you!>
Having said that...Today, I am unable to locate the answer to my question. We are lucky enough to live in a coastal community just South of Sarasota FL. Our neighborhood sits next to the Gulf of Mexico. (Yes, it's heavenly...until hurricane season kicks in!)
<Yup!>
We find little crabs and such in abundance on our beach (small sand sifting crabs and coquina clams). We don't like to purchase items for our reef that come from the wild. We'd much rather purchase aquacultured frags and items.
<I share your views!>
Would bringing home a few coquina's have any impact on our neighborhood beach?
<Well, you asked...In my opinion, I would really avoid taking anything from the neighborhood beach. I remember vividly one of my biology professors in college advising us to "take nothing but pictures" and to "leave nothing but footprints" on our local beaches in SoCal.) Sure, a few crabs may not seem to be a lot of impact, but if enough people take just a few, the next thing you know, there could be significant issues down the line, not only for the population of the animals that you are collecting, but to other animals that may depend on them for food or other services. Not to mention the fact that you should ALWAYS check with the local authorities concerning the legality of collecting wildlife in your area. Permits/licenses may be required.>
We would like to know if you can tell us a little about the possible perils of bringing a little of our beach into our reef tank.
Here are our specs:
55 gal show size tank
Power Comp lights:
130 watts of actinic 03
130 watts of 50/50 actinic 03 10,000K
130 watts of 10,000k
approx. 4" live sand bed
We've lost track of how many pounds of rock - maybe 75 lbs?
2 - 3 Stripe Damsels
1 Percula Clown
assorted Zoos and Mushrooms
2 small Acropora frags
Pipe Organ
1 med size sand sifting star
crabs, snails
1 big fat Mexican Turbo snail
Thanks very much,
Amy G
<Well, Amy- besides the potential environmental impact and possible legal ramifications of collecting local wildlife, their introduction into your aquarium could present some problems, specifically, the introduction of possible parasites and diseases. If you do end up collecting specimens for your aquarium, careful and mandatory quarantine is absolutely essential, and acclimation to your aquarium must be done carefully. You certainly sounds like a conscientious aquarist, so I'm sure that you'll do all the necessary research regarding the viability of this venture, and that you'll take the right steps to assure that the transition to captive life is a smooth one for the animals that you intend to collect.>

Re: Corals as Carry-On? - 04/05/07
Hi
<<Hello Jorge>>
I finally heard back from the TSA on Carrying Live coral as Carry-on.  The answer was pretty Vague.  See Below:
Thank you for your e-mail.  
The Transportation Security Administration's current security screening procedures require all carry-on luggage and accessible property be screened before passengers take them onboard an aircraft.  Regardless of whether an item is on the prohibited or permitted items list, the Transportation Security Officers (TSO's) have discretion to prohibit an individual from carrying an item through the screening checkpoint or onboard an aircraft if the item poses a security threat.  Therefore, TSA security screening personnel make the final decision on whether to permit items like a live piece of coral into the sterile area of the airport.  Should you need additional assistance, feel free to contact us at toll free 866-289-9673.  Please visit our website at www.tsa.gov for additional information about TSA.  We continue to add new information and encourage you to check the website frequently for updated information.  We hope this information is helpful.
TSA Contact Center
<<Mmm, so it would appear from this, the possibility of you carrying this coral aboard the aircraft is a matter of pure chance.  Perhaps if you post this question on the reef message forums (RC/reefs.org) you can find some folks who have tried this recently and get a better feel for how airport security is handling this situation.  Regards, EricR>>

Getting the Last Fish Out, Light Shock  2/28/07
Hi Crew,
<Hi Tom!  Mich here.>
I have the unpleasant task of removing all the fish from my reef tank to treat for a Crypt infestation.
<I'm sorry for your trouble.>
The latest addition, and only recent one, was a Mandarin that I did QT but obviously not well enough because a week later some of the others are showing Crypt. Here's a list of the fish we have in the 135G reef display:
Purple Tang
Hippo Tang
Percula Pair
Flame Angel
Royal Gramma
Yellow Watchman Goby
Mandarin
The Tangs were easy to trap, and I think I'll get the Clowns, Gramma, and eventually the Goby. I'm having doubts about ever trapping the Angel and Mandarin, and nets are useless. This reef tank is now well established with a lot of SPS coral that has fused rocks together, and just can't be broken down without doing damage...but maybe it will have to come to that. Since I'm going to have to get every fish out of the tank, do you have any advice or unusual tactics for catching them?
I hate to even ask this dumb question, but as an extreme measure is there any way to stun these last fish just enough to help capture them (e.g. cold, heat, anything?) without causing long term problems for the fish or the coral? I suspect the answer is "no", but in the past I've received Liveaquaria fish shipments where the bag water was down to about 60 degrees, and the fish were moving pretty slowly. I sure don't want to harm the fish, but I don't want to see them die of Crypt anyway, and slow down the fallow process just because I can't get them out.
<One method that I have heard that you might try is turning the lights off in the middle of the day when they are normally on.  Allow the lights to stay off for a period of time gather you nets, catch containers etc. and turn the lights back on.  This can induce a shock like state which may allow you to capture your... victims? ...I mean fish.  Don't know if this will work for certain, but I think it is worth trying.>
Thanks,
<Good luck!  I wish you success!  -Mich>
Tom

Re: Getting the Last Fish Out, Light Shock, Tank Trap  - 03/02/07
Thanks for the lights off/on idea, I did try it. The ones that are left (Gramma, Flame, Mandarin) can still disappear, they seem to know their reef so well they aren't even findable when they hide, let alone catchable out in the open.  Tried both the halides and a bright flashlight.
<Maybe you didn't leave the light off long enough, you want to induce a "sleep" period.  You could also try doing when the lights are normally off.>
Any other ideas, even if not entirely humane for the short term?
Might be better than letting the Crypt kill them slowly.
<I have also heard of a method using a small tank as seen here:
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.pennplax.com/Images/AQUAscans/Tank%2520Kits/HermitCrabKitCl.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.pennplax.com/Pages/Aqua.pages..../
Aqua27F.html&h=288&w=279&sz=12&hl=en&start=5&tbnid=aR6CJFfeKDSX0M:&tbnh=
115&tbnw=111&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dhermit%2Bcrab%2Btank%26svnum%3D10%26hl%
3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den%26sa%3DN
Place this tank in you display with the lid open.  Then feed only by placing the food inside the tiny tank.  Once the fish go in you will have to close the top.  Getting the fish to go is the challenge.  I have heard of some success with this method.  My last experience was quite some time ago, but I ended up ripping the entire tank apart.  Try some of the message boards too, the more minds the better.  I know how frustrating it can be.  If only you could reason with them.  It would make things so much easier.  A few more ideas here:  http://www.wetwebmedia.com/movelvstkfaqs.htm  
Good luck to you Tom!  Let us know what ends up working for you.>  
Thanks,
<Welcome!  -Mich> <<Mich... Tom... drain the tank, remove the LR... take the fishes out, replace the LR and water... RMF>>
Tom

Collecting Marine Invertebrates - 12/02/06
Hi,
<<Hello!>>
I am new reef aquarist.
<<Welcome to the hobby>>
However, I have very quickly become passionate about it!
<<All too easy to do...though my wife's term for it is "obsessed">>
I am a veterinarian and I own a small animal practice.  I have begun to take classes and read books, and now, online posts in order to become knowledgeable enough about fish and invertebrates to add them to the long list of exotics I already treat.
<<Excellent!>>
I am very interested in ocean conservation and I would like to begin by having reef tanks at my hospital.
<<Cool…I don’t usually recommend reef systems for “office” environments, as they tend to suffer from the frequent and periodic neglect (unless HIGHLY automated) during weekends/holidays.  But as a veterinarian, I’m assuming someone comes in “daily” to tend to the animals boarded/recovering from surgery/etc and could thus see to the reef systems as well>>
I have been quite successful in sustaining invertebrates in my reef tank.  I would like to use what I am learning to research the propagation of wild populations in captivity for the education of my clients and hopefully to add to what is known about captive sustainability.
<<Hmm...have you seen/read Anthony Calfo's book 'Book of Coral Propagation, Volume 1: Reef Gardening for Aquarists'?>>
I am aware that in order to collect and transport from country to country I must possess a C.I.T.E.S. permit.  But, what sort of permit is required for collection within my state, within the U.S., with no intention to export?
<<Laws will vary from state to state; I recommend you contact your state's Department of Natural Resources and/or Department of Fish and Game.  These agencies should be able to provide guidance on licensing requirements and species limits/restrictions...if any>>
Thank you so much for your wonderful web site!
Kathye
<<Happy you think so.  EricR>>

Catching a regal tang  – 11/15/06
Thanks for the help with this.  
<< You’re most welcome. >>
Ultimately, the easiest way to catch it, was to wait until nighttime, move a few rocks to gain access, and reach my gloved hand in to the tank and simply pick it up.  One needs to be very wary of the spines on the dorsal fin, but otherwise, if caught at night, the fish does not thrash or fight, it simply allows you to pick it up and take it out of the tank.
<< Hehe I wish this technique worked as well for me when I tried it with a Passer Angel. I used a red military filter on an old army flashlight to find the fish about 3 hours after lights out and ended up with a gill spine puncture in my hand! Alas, every fish and situation are different and I'm glad you had a successful catch! I hope your tank is doing well after removal of the problem child. – Emerson >>
Lisa

Moving X-LARGE Queen Trigger   11/5/06
Hello!
<Hi there>
I am going to be moving our store's mascot tomorrow and would like your opinion on some of the methods we are thinking of using.  And, if you have any recommendations, please give me some!  :)
<Hotay!>
Our mascot is a 17 inch Queen Triggerfish.  She is going to be moved into a 180 gallon tank - she's in a 55 gallon right now.  The tank isn't even a full two feet away from her current tank.  We are going to move her tomorrow, and we will be filmed for our local news station, so we want this to look good!  :)  She will be fully acclimated by a drip method before the move happens.
As for the methods we have thought about...
1.  "bucketing" her.  This would involve scooping her up into a bucket and then gently submersing the bucket into the 180.
<This is best... do watch your hands/fingers... and back while lifting>
2.  "toweling" her.  This would involve placing a wet bath towel into the tank and scooping her up.  Then clutching the top so that she cannot escape.  Then submersing the towel and the trigger into the new tank.
3.  "bagging" her.  This would involve taking a large plastic bag (12 x 20), filling it with aquarium water from her current tank, and having that set aside.  Then take two other of the bags, make slits in the center of the bag, and then scoop her up with that, placing that into the bag of water, and then gently submersing her into the tank.
<Will likely chew right through most any thickness, multiple bags>
Unfortunately, this fish will not deal with a net, she is too strong, which is why I am not going to "bag" her as most would do.  Float the bag, etc.  
If you have any recommendations for me, I would love to hear them!  :)
Thanks so much!
Wendy Legeret
Wendy's Blue Lagoon
<A suitably large, semi-flexible bucket is best here. Good moving! Bob Fenner>

Fish anesthetization in the aquarium  9/9/06
Dear Crew,
I have done a fair amount of research on the anesthetization of fish.  
I give anesthesia (human) for a living so I understand the chemistry and pharmacology of the agents available.
<Ah, good>
I need to get a Magnificent Foxface Rabbitfish out of my 300 g. saltwater aquarium. I, and my wife, and my son (who works for the LFS) have tried many times to capture this fish, I have tried to use the bottle trap a number of times... suffice to say that because of the design of the tank and the layout of the live rock (many, many, many hiding places) I have decided to begin researching anesthetizing, or at least sedating the fish just enough so that I can net it, and get it back to the LFS.
They pointed me to MS-222, and I have done further research into tertiary amyl alcohol and other agents also including Carbon Dioxide.
<Mmm, I would use none of these in an established aquarium. And have used all of these...>
All the info I have found so far describes the use of the agent with the fish already in an isolated container. Obviously if I had the fish in an isolated container, I wouldn't have a problem, so what I would like is your view of using some type of agent in the aquarium itself. I realize that this will affect the other fish (One 10" Naso Tang, one 5" Banggai Cardinal, one 3" Lawnmower Blenny, one 3" Blue Spotted Jawfish, one 2" Hector's Goby), the 5 serpent stars and about 30 corals to some degree or another.
Any thoughts, or suggestions you may have would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
Dave Harvey
<If it were me/mine, I'd first try a fashioned "squeeze net" to push the one fish down toward one end (two inert poles and some reasonable size mesh netting)... and two hand nets once isolated in a smaller, more manageable volume... or "bite the proverbial bullet" and drain the tank down... into containers it can be re-pumped back into the main tank... Bob Fenner>

Re: fish anesthetization in the aquarium  - 09/14/06
Thanks Bob,
<Welcome David>
have contemplated your suggestions, but without basically dismantling the rockwork even a fashioned net doesn't seem like a workable solution in this tank. If I do drain the tank isn't this at least as much stress on the other fish and corals as any exogenous agent might be?
<Mmm, might be>
Not to mention this Foxface is really good at locking itself in under rocks- do you just suggest waiting until he is debilitated under these conditions and then removing him?
<Mmm... well... best not to wait>
Is that really any different than turning all pumps off, waiting for the Oxygen to drop, the fish to get sluggish and taking him out?
<Not advised>
I'm thinking that at least that way, no denizen will have also been above the water surface and O2 will be immediately be re-established when the pumps are turned back on.
<Perhaps... but could also (easily) trigger a chain of reactions resulting in most alls death>
I did speak at length with John Hosch, the curator of the Monterey Bay Aquarium in California and he says that they use oil of cloves in the field squirted directly at a particular fish when they need to rescue a fish that is hiding in rocks, of course in that situation the volume of diluent is much greater and the effect on the other organisms in the area is much less of a concern.
<Yes... can be done>
We discussed using a similar approach with a syringe and a soft catheter attached and shooting it directly at the Foxface, then immediately doing a water change and using carbon after the fish is out.
Your further thoughts would, as always be greatly appreciated.
thanks again,
Dave Harvey
<You've tried training this fish to dried/sheet algae? With a large plastic framed net under... till classical habituation allows the easy removal... Bob Fenner>

Catching fish   8/17/06
Hi Crew,
Removing a fish is a subject always coming up. I would like to suggest something that works for me, but it is still not easy. Using two nets,
which has been mentioned before, but do it with the tank lights out. The fish has a hard time seeing the nets in this case. Unfortunately you will
also have a hard time seeing the fish. But I think this puts the odds in your favor. You may need someone with a flashlight to help if the room light is not enough.
<Thank you for this Samuel. Bob Fenner>

Catching Fish... Any Easy Way?  - 8/9/2006
Hey crew,
<Yo>
Do you have any good techniques for removing fish from a tank without the need to remove every piece of live rock? Surely,
<My name is not Shirley:)>
there must be an easier way, and if there is, I'm sure you guys would know about it!
<No easy way my friend.  Using two nets can help some, and removing some of the water reduces hiding places, but a word of caution here...If your rock is delicately balanced, mmm.  I've tried bait boxes with little or no success, so don't waste your money on these.>
Thanks.
<You're welcome.  James (Salty Dog)>

Spot on Marine Angel fish... owee from decompression procedure?   7/31/06
Hello crew,
<Laurie>
I've been researching on your website, but can't seem find an exact match for a possible issue with my marine angel.
I purchased a Swallowtail angel two week ago.  She is isolated in my QT.  
I did not freshwater dip her prior to putting her in the QT.  
<Not always advisable>
A few days after bringing her home, I noticed a small white bump on her side.  It's about the size of a scale.  I thought that perhaps it might be a single parasite, so at that time I did capture her for a buffered (baking soda to ~8.2 pH) freshwater dip (with methylene blue).  However, I removed her after only 1 minute, as she started to thrash, which scared me.
<Can be scary>
Now, after about 10 days, it has turned a yellow-brown.  No other spots are on her.  I have decided to leave her in the QT until that spot is gone, but feel that I should know what it is, so that I can further treat her properly, if needed.
<Good. This is what I would likely do as well>
I tried to get a picture, but she freaks out at the camera and I can't catch her in a frame!
Oh - I added a skunk cleaner, thinking that if it is a parasite,
<Excellent>
or actually, anything else that needs to be cleaned off, that he could assist.  I have seen her letting him hop on occasionally.  But, the spot is still there.
Would you know what this spot might be?
<Mmm, likely a "sore" from the process of capture... most likely a/the entrance of a needle to "decompress" this animal... Many marine fishes are caught at depths that make such "gas bladder bleeding" expedient, rather than the long-wait of bringing to the surface slowly...>
Thank you for your help - both past and present.
Regards,
Laurie O.
<Keep your eye on water quality, and don't be too wary of moving/placing this Genicanthus sp. in your main system. Very likely it is relatively disease free. Bob Fenner>

Re: Spot on Marine Angel fish   7/31/06
Hi Bob,
<Laur>
Thank you.  That's great news.  I will plan on moving her this coming weekend, then.  (That will be a full 3 weeks in QT.)
<Good>
  Water quality is pretty good in the QT - ammonia and nitrite at 0; nitrate at 20 ppm.  I just did a 5% water change, too.
I have another, unrelated question for you, if you don't mind?
<Sure>
I was poking around yesterday, and found on this page:  http://www.wetwebmedia.com/mardisindex.htm; under the section "Biological/Pathogenic Disease: Identification, Pathogens/Agents, a photo that shows zigzag lines/trails on what may be live rock (or is it a fish?).
<Oh! Is a pic of nematodes, Roundworms encysted in the dermis of a Moray Eel...>
It is the fourth photo down in this section.  I looked at all of the links to the left, but could not find that photo in any of those links.  Do you know what the zigzag lines are?
<Yes... please see here: http://wetwebmedia.com/fshwrmdisfaq2.htm
about mid-way down... the same pic>
We've had three occasions of something looking exactly like these in our 110 display tank.
<Mmm>
  Twice on the glass wall, once on a rock.  We thought they were snail eggs.  But, now I'm worried, because your photo is under the disease section!  
Thanks again,
Laurie O.
<There are many such-appearing living "things"... likely what you saw were actually eggs... most likely of a mollusk of some sort. Not to worry re. Bob Fenner>

Re: Mandarin quarantine question... Secrets of fish-catching   7/12/06
Hi Bob and WWM crewmaties,
<Steve>
I thought I'd share my success in how I was able to remove 9 small and speedy fish from my 125 gallon reef tank. This was done to move them into a quarantine tank for treating an ich outbreak. I managed to do this, but I did go through a certain degree of trouble.
<Good>
STEP #1- I first searched the WWM website for tips on how to catch fish. I also searched the web for other ideas. What I found ranged from night sneak attacks to buying or making a fish trap. One suggestion was to place a sizeable plastic bag in the tank and to lure fish in the bag with food. These and other techniques may work for some fish, but none were successful with my fish- shrimp goby, six line wrasse, flame angel, bi-color blenny, royal Gramma, etc. I was able to catch my clown pair by engaging in a bit of hunt and chase. The old "two net approach" did the trick.
Many reefers resolved themselves to simply tearing down their tanks. I did not want to face this option, given the many hours I spend aquascaping my masterpiece.
OK, here is my technique. When the plastic bag idea failed (the bag would not stay open properly due to water movement, etc.), I tried a similar technique using plastic mesh. This was material similar to the stuff capture nets are made from. I was able to get a hold of this material from my place of work. Well, this idea didn't work, either. Although I was able to keep the mesh purse I made to stay open sufficiently, the fish wanted nothing to do with this contraption. Baiting the purse with food did not entice them, either. I know, we're dealing with little brains that have had millions of years of evolution and genetic programming to learn how to stay clear of danger.
My brainstorm was to use this mesh material to enclose one end (only ~1/3) of my tank. Window screen material (if safe) or something similar can be used in place. I used suction cups from my utility powerheads to attach the mesh to each front and rear glass side of my tank. The suction cups were attached to the mesh with simple supermarket twisties. I used some additional material to double-up on the ends to make sure no gaps were present. I dug the mesh into the substrate and piled sand around the edges to make it secure.
I only affixed one end of the mesh gate, keeping it open to chase the fish to that end. I simply moved the corals and other inverts to the free end of the tank. I was able to chase a few fish (angel, blenny, royal Gramma) to the capture end without too much trouble. I closed the net, removed a few pieces of live rock, and whammo- net your fish. Yes, this part of the tank will pretty much have to be dismantled. I drew pictures and took some measurements of key rock placement to simplify reassembly.
I figured the toughest fish to catch would be the goby. He pretty much stayed in one or two burrows excavated by the pistol shrimp. I was careful to place the mesh screen to ensure his burrow was in the capture zone. This took a little doing, but it did work. This little guy, Orange-striped Shrimp Goby, is FAST and able to zip into the substrate, burrow or no burrow. During one part, the goby managed to get in the clear-zone part of my tank. Another idea of mine used left-over tubing from my RO water filter to blow bubbles into the bottom of my tank to chase the fish. This worked great and did not hurt or disturb my corals.
The toughest fish to catch was the six line wrasse and purple firefish. Chasing them was tricky. I managed to capture the wrasse (the last one) simply by keeping the mesh gate open, waiting for him to venture to that side, and enclosing him for a simple capture. While not perfect, this technique does work, especially for larger reef tanks. Now, if I'd only set-up a quarantine tank first...
Steve
<Thank you for sharing. Bob Fenner>

Sweepers  3/30/06
I've have already searched through your website and have not been able to locate any information.  I have a question regarding sweepers, who I believe are in the family Pempheridae.
<Ah, yes....!>
  Why don't you see them offered for sale?
<Good question... hot hard to find in reef, coastal/rocky settings... and easy to catch (have done so)... But don't take to handling well (die easily with scale, slime loss from netting)... and the one real reason: They're "not on the list"... of items/animals folks order/buy through the "chain of custody"... A phenomenon I call the Founder/Flounder Effect... "Folks don't ask for things they don't know about, so they don't see/gain exposure because they didn't get caught, because no one asked for them...">
I see them in reef pictures all the time (usually hovering around a coral head along with various Cardinalfish), so it appears as though they are fairly common.  Are they difficult to keep?
<Have been kept by Public Aquariums off/on... but the vast majority of caught specimens die in a short while...>
Are they similar to the Anthias species in that they need to be frequently fed in order to be successfully kept?  Or do they simply not ship well?
<Good questions... I know naught. Bob Fenner>
Thanks for your help,
Brian Lory

Costa Rica marine life collection for personal use   3/25/06
Ladies and Gentlemen,
<Ron>
Need a specific answer regarding who in Costa Rica I would need to contact to secure a permit to collect my own marine specimens . Will be flying into Liberia, Costa Rica.
Thanx
Ron
<Mmm... likely their "Dept. of Natural Resources"... and/or export office of the government (start this now... takes a good long while). Will you be staying with folks in the trade there? I would ask them to let you use their collecting and exporting permits, and as importantly, tools and materials for successfully boxing, shipping your catch. The OFI members list may help you to identify folks involved in the industry there. Bob Fenner>

Collecting in Kauai?   3/4/06
Hey crew,
<Eric>
I was going to go snorkeling / diving on the island of Kauai this spring.  I was wondering what I need to do to maybe collect a fish or
coral for my aquarium (being that I am good enough to actually catch it).
<Mmm, the fish... not advised, the coral, illegal>
I was wondering if you can point me in the direction of portable filtration / oxygen / heat supply for the flight home.  I was planning
on flying out in the evening if I can so I can do the collection the morning/afternoon of my flight.
<Much better to buy animals there (if you want to...) that have been "pooped out" (non-technical term, but necessary), otherwise "hardened" by a few to several days time in captivity (post collection)...>
Do you know where I can find paper work to get a temporary license to harvest wild life legally?
<... You could get a fishing license from the DNR...>
  Also is there any advice you could give me for collecting small fish or maybe a small piece of coral.
<I have a piece on the subject posted here: http://wetwebmedia.com/collhiway.htm and the linked files above...>
I will only have about 1 gallon of water, with a small air supply. I was thinking of getting some heating packs for keeping the temp good.
I really don't want to hurt anything in this process.  I just want a little keep sake for my home aquarium.  
Thanks
Eric
<Read. Bob Fenner>

Removing troublesome fish  - 2/4/2006
Hello,
         I have a 125 gal reef tank with many inverts and corals. I would like your advice on how to remove 2 blue damsels and 1 freckled hawkfish from this aquarium.
<Condition to come to surface, corner through feeding... could try traps... baited... sold by folks like Dr.s Foster and Smith... or have to drain tank...>
I don't want to disturb my 120+ pounds of live rock or my corals. The corals are all growing and are happy where they are. Is there any way I can catch these?
<Small barbless, baited hooks?>
I have heard of placing a hook in the aquarium with the barb removed and place some food on it, but this seems difficult because the damsels mouth is very small. I would like to place them in a 10 gallon tank quarantine tank for 2 months. I suspect some ich and would like to let the tank fallow. I have seen some traps available but have never used them. Netting these fish is impossible due to the amount of corals and hiding places in my reef. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you...
<Good hunting. Bob Fenner>

Australia Collecting License and fence/barrier nets   1/17/06
Hi Bob am looking to buy a fish collecting licenses in Australia what do you think and were can you bye fence nets etc Hank
<Mmm, licenses in the "Land Down Under" are closely numbered and regulated. Likely you would have to become a citizen, and either buy into an existing one, or add your name to a list, lottery to win one if/when same became available. Fence nets can be made (I used to do this... don't!), or bought from outfits that make them by machine... Look to the aquaculture industry, magazines... I used to get mine from Memphis Net & Twine. Bob Fenner>

Hunting for eels! 11/6/05
Hi, my name is William; I live on an island in the Caribbean. I live on the shore and lately have been chasing after what I believe to be chain-link morays.
<Most common species in shallow water there...>
It seems to be tougher than I expected. I was wondering if there are anyways of attracting these magnificent eels to a certain area. Just the other night I went to look for them since they are nocturnal, but I believe they went out to sea for feeding. The area I usually find them in is a small cove covered in spiny lobster, parrotfish, sea urchins, and green morays.
Recently I have seen three of them in the span of two days. Two of them were large averaging about one and a half feet long. The third though was quite skinny and was about eight inches long. Any help would be greatly appreciated, thank you.
<Can be caught in "minnow traps" incorporating a fyke on one/both end/s... with bait inside. Or with a barbless hook and line, with something meaty for bait... or via a small fence and hand net... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/collmarsdvg.htm and the linked files above, and the accounts on moray eels archived on WWM. Bob Fenner> 

Collecting sand, water, flora and fauna from Carolina Coast 10/13/05
WWM team and friends, Good day and hope you are all well. I want to first state for all of us out here in apprentice/journeyman land, appreciation for your patience and expertise. 
<Thanks for the kind words! We are truly happy to help and contribute!>
Item 1: Unrelated to topic but have to state to Bob the last status on the SeaClone 100 skimmer (my pc crashed, lost all mail so thread is not intact). It has been up and running over a month now and contrary to most popular opinion, working rather well. I recommend it. 
The new revisions seem to be fine-it could still be improved but can't everything? I am getting dry foam and about 1 1/2 cups a week of green/black stout from a 38 gallon tank with 27 gallons of actual water (yes, I was anal about ensuring I knew how much water for dosing, changes, etc.. :) ). So if you like, feel free to post this part with the other thread on the skimmer section. Only issue is that for the money, I should have gotten the 150. 
Local P*TSm*rt stores here honor their online web price that is generally $30 less than their actual stores and other LFS in the area wanted $130 and up for this skimmer - not a good buy then :). Only question on skimmers in general is do ya have to use a prefilter sponge? When you take it out to clean it, half of the stuff it filtered leaks into the tank anyway so what's the point? 
<I am glad to hear that your SeaClone is working. Your experience is truly and exception. Prefilters are not necessary.>
Item 2: The meat of the questions. I have the opportunity to get a gently used 75g glass/stand/canopy with darn near everything including canister, lighting and Magnum HOT for CHEAP. I would like to use my knowledge acquired from YOUR brains to do a better job this time, however, I am still a cheapskate soon to being out of work. <It is nice to find good deals! I am not a fan of canister or HO filters for marine tanks (see here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_2/cav2i5/Filtration/Filtration.htm). I would suggest selling these filters an applying the proceeds to live rock and a skimmer.>
Since I live a couple hours from Wilmington, NC and my brother has a beach house one block from the sound, intracoastal AND TopSail beach that I have access to (he is the comfortable one in the family), I would like to know if it would be an okay mix to use sound/surf sand and water and perhaps plant life, yet, stock with the typical tropical flora and fauna like damsels, crabs, corals, etc..? 
<There are many issues with this. Any temperate life (brought with sand or intentionally introduced) will not survive for long at tropical temperatures. Some tropical species make their way up into the Carolinas during summer months, but you have to really know your stuff!>
The water tests well for sg and basic tests. The sand is fine, brown Atlantic sand, not aragonite. Not sure if it has silicates but have to imagine it is as good or better than the Home Depot sand so many people seem to rave about that looks like someone swept up sand blasting sand after use and put it in a bag for sale.... Additionally, I do find small rubble rock and would like to know if this is appropriate as well. 
<This sand is surely high in silica, although I am don't believe that this is a significant problem. I would be more worried about pollutants (sewerage, fertilizers, pesticides, boat fuel, etc.) from sand collected on or near shore. "Live sand" is generally collected from areas around reefs in at least a couple of tens of feet of water. The same applies to the rubble. Using natural sea water for water changes has many benefits if you have access to it, but it can also introduce pollution or disease if you aren't careful.>
I am not a naturalist and don't know the micro flora/fauna indigenous to my region but imagine that in using the sand/water I will likely find out and want to ensure that it is ok. I have refrained from using local saltwater to this point not for fear of contaminants or pollution (NC is actually highly stringent in enforcement since we are a shellfish producer) but for fear of it not being correct in some way from the normal environs of the stock. 
If that is not an issue, I much would rather trek down to Wilmington for a weekend or two a month at the beach for free and stock up on water than continue to spend $$$$$ on RO and salt mix. And spend those dollars on caring for my marine dependents in other ways like a refugium and such. 
I would imagine the local water has good bacteria strains as well that the mix does not. I would also imagine that cycling should be much more effective. Your thoughts? Sincere appreciation and regards, Bill 
<While the use of NSW is inexpensive, the risks are also high. It may work well for a while, but it is a game of Russian roulette. Facilities that use NSW usually filter it aggressively as well as ozonize it to prevent introduction of pathogens and pollutants. This process is only cost effective on a large scale. Best Regards. AdamC.>

Moral fish dilemma  9/11/05
Hi Bob,
  I have been browsing through WetWebMedia.com but I didn't come across any
articles that are related to my dilemma. I apologize in advance if I have
overseen any previously answered questions. So, basically I recently started
my first saltwater tank and went netting with my friend in Long Island, NY.
We didn't really expect to catch anything but thought it would be fun to
try, nevertheless. However, we ended up netting 3 juvenile lookdowns, 1
adult lookdown, 3 tiny puffers, 2 tiny flounders, and 2 tiny butterfly fish.
The major problem is that the tank I have right now is only 29 gallons and
as I've read on this website, its not good to keep a lookdown in anything
less than about a 150 gallon tank. However, if I release the fish back into
the Long Island water, I know they are going to die once winter sets in. At
the same time, I have neither the resources nor the experience to maintain a
150 gallon tank. In your expert opinion, what should I do? Would I be able
to sell the lookdowns or donate them? I would really appreciate any help you
could give me. Thanks!
-Rush
<I would call the local fish stores, aquarium service companies, the NY Aquarium Society president, board members, and ask for their assistance here. Bob Fenner>

Going Fishing For Dominoes - 06/03/05
Well I have a 500 hundred gallon acrylic aquarium and I have 2 domino damsel in there from day one.  They are huge 5" in dia..  And there laying eggs all over.  But my problem is they are nipping my other fish and are very aggressive and disturbing the gravel substrate and making the tank always look cloudy.  My question to you is how can I catch them I tried several times but they are to fast for me to catch and the top of my aquarium only has hatches, all I wind up doing is upsetting the rest of the fish.  Any help I would appreciate. And of coarse I would find them a good home.  
<<Had this very same problem myself years ago before I learned better.  Domino damsels are the cutest little buggers when they're about the size of your thumbnail...but it doesn't take long for them to grow up mean and nasty!  I solved my domino problem by using a small barbless fish hook, some very fine monofilament fishing line, and a bit of raw table shrimp.  This tactic is surprisingly effective due the fishes natural aggressiveness.  Give it a try!  It's actually less stressful/harmful to the fish than chasing it around with a net.  And provides a great little ultra-light tackle workout as well <G>.>>
That's jimmy... Ps I love you web sight thanks
<<Regards, Eric R.>>

Catching wild marine fish
Bob, if I go on vacation to a tropical area where I would dive, can I try to catch certain fish, if I see them, and ship them back home to put in my aquarium?
Thanks
Gabe
<Can indeed be done... and is a great deal of fun (and learning experience). I have a few articles posted on WWM re this, and we have a good deal of pertinent input from others archived in FAQs files on the topic. Bob Fenner> 

Re: White Fecal Matter, actually trapping fish/es in large tanks
I have a follow-up question. I have a 250 gallon full reef display tank in my living room. I have a Powder Blue tang which may or may not be suffering from a spot of lymphocytes. As I mentioned, it is a full reef, so the moment a net comes anywhere near my tank, the fish dart behind the rocks. I don't want to have to remove all the corals and live rock and millions (not really millions, but it seems like it) of inverts. Any suggestions on removing this fish with a trap? If so, any particular ones? Any good methodology for achieving this?
Thanks for any advice.
<The best such trap is a large net, conditioning the fish to not respond to its presence... takes time... days to weeks... but leaving the plastic or all-plastic coated net in the tank, feeding above it can/does work. Bob Fenner>

Slurp guns in Australia?
Hello Bob,
I have recently setup a 6' marine aquarium and it seems to have stabilized (4mths on). The tank is fairly bare at the moment, no live rock as yet, (at $20/Kg I'm saving up)
<Yowzah! At this price almost worth making your own!>
8 or 9 small fish and a slipper lobster. My first question is, will the addition of the 100Kg of live rock that it is suggested a tank of this size needs require any time for water quality to stabilize again?
<Absolutely! Do cure it elsewhere, place maybe ten kilos a week, with testing>
On the central coast of N.S.W. Australia where I live (33 deg. Sth) our waters are classified as temperate; having said that, each summer a warm current brings a range of juvenile tropicals down from the north (G.B.R.). 20 years ago I had some reasonable success collecting several species of Chaetodons, Heniochus, Scorpionfish and the like while snorkeling (very strict collection rules down here).  Unfortunately for the little fellows, when the water cools in Autumn from 25deg. down to 16deg. Celsius...
<Brrrr!>
...my earlier assumption that the fish receded back north with the current is wrong. The silly buggers stay here and die.
<Yes>
I'll get to my second query. I'm not sure if its my age or the fish are quicker than I remember but I desperately need to find a supplier in Australia that sells slurp guns (hand scoops are the only other option allowed here). I bought one back in the dark ages in Sydney (early 80's) but can't find one in Oz these days. I realize that it's a very long distance request, but can you advise me where to look?
<Mmm, come to think of it... I don't recall seeing these sold anywhere, anytime I've been there... I take it you've tried the Net... dive shops... are there any large acrylic fabrication businesses in large towns in the country you could contact re? If anybody knew of folks making them, they would>
If you can't help with an Australian source I have a friend in Ohio who may be able to purchase one for me if there are any in that area. I'm trying to avoid the hassles and risks of shipping one from the states if possible.
<There are some medium quality units still made by Aquacraft, I think still in S. Cal., but I don't see a URL for them through Google>
P.S; A word of advice for the earlier request by a fellow concerning the Ballina Angelfish, they are totally protected in our waters.
<Thank you for this. Bob Fenner>

Rotenone - Fish Collecting
http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0402/feature3/zoom1.html 
<Thanks for this. See you soon. BobF>

Collecting live marine animals for personal use
Hello to all , I have enjoyed collecting small animals most of my life, Now with a 7 year old son we explore many habitats for creatures of all kinds. We have recently a heightened interest in a reef tank and we are both excellent in the water, I scuba and skin dive. I would like to know practical ways to safely capture and transport marine life back to my home town of Cincinnati , Ohio any suggestions on equipment and techniques are appreciated Thanks Lawrence and Ashton
<Please read the articles and FAQs archived here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/MarInd3of6.htm - scroll down to "Collection...". Bob Fenner>

Collecting in Panama
Hello crew-but especially for Bob,
         I am trying to contact anyone who has information regarding
collection and export of marine fish from Panama.  In past articles
about Mexico collection, Bob had mentioned that Panama appeared to be
"wide open". I have tried to find anyone who could give me a contact
without success. I even have had one person comment that they were closed
to export.
        You recently have had questions from someone living in Portobelo
area of Panama, and although he doesn't appear to be a collector, I am
wondering if  he could be of any help.
       Do you have any suggestions or comments, Thank you, respectfully,
Grant
<Mmm, the OFI doesn't list any members for Panama unfortunately:
http://www.ornamental-fish-int.org/members/members-directory.asp
and I haven't been to Los Angeles in a few months, not that my memory is all that intact... but I do believe there are still collectors operating on both sides of the canal. You might try contacting the federal "fish and game" there, maybe even the local tropical fish stores to ask where they get their livestock... even the "yellow page" directory under Pescados Tropicales... Bob Fenner>

Hooked on fish, worried divers seeking limits
This story was sent to you by: Pryor
Bob & Crew
Thought you would find this interesting.  Any feedback on it?
thanks
-Ray
<Thank you. My notes below>
--------------------
Hooked on fish, worried divers seeking limits
--------------------
Florida may curb pet-trade catches
By David Fleshler, Tribune Newspapers: South Florida Sun-Sentinel. Staff photographer Joe Amon contributed to this report
November 25, 2004
About 3 miles off the coast of Islamorada, Ken Nedimyer glides along the ocean floor, trailing bubbles from his scuba gear and carrying two nets.
Two yellow Jawfish emerge from their sandy holes. He squirts them with an anesthetic called Quinaldine and scoops them up. Within a few days the fish would be airborne, packed in oxygen-rich water, on their way to aquarium-supply stores in Cleveland and Columbus, Ohio.
Nedimyer is among a group of highly skilled Florida divers who earn a living providing live fish for the aquarium trade. He knows where to find angelfish, blue tangs and dozens of other species sought by collectors. Equally important, he knows how to get them alive to Chicago or Phoenix or New York.
But with fish stocks around the world threatened by overfishing, Florida wildlife officials have decided to impose limits on the business of catching live fish for the pet trade. At the urging of Nedimyer and other professionals, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission has proposed rules that would reduce the number of permits and offer only limited ones to non-professionals.
<Fish stocks have never been shown to be challenged by the ornamental industry... our means of collection are inefficient, scattered>
"This fishery is largely pursued in sensitive areas, particularly coral reef areas," said Lee Schlesinger, spokesman for the commission, a board appointed by the governor that sets the rules for hunting, fishing and wildlife protection. "A lot of people go out and dive and just look at these animals, and we want to make sure there's plenty there for folks to enjoy over the years."
<Who pays these peoples' wages?>
Florida and Hawaii are the only states with substantial aquarium-trade fisheries. In Florida, an estimated 75 to 100 people make a living catching live fish for the aquarium trade, along with about the same number of part-timers. Most work out of South Florida, along the coral reefs that stretch from the Keys through Palm Beach County.
Tom Scaturro, owner of Tom's Caribbean Tropicals of Tavernier in the Keys, dives one day a week. He faxes a list of what he has caught to about 200 pet shops and aquariums, and he posts price lists on his Web page. This week's offerings include medium-size sea cucumbers for $4 each, large blue tangs for $40, a large strawberry grouper for $12, a porcupine puffer for $24 and dozens of other fish, plants and invertebrates.
On Sunday he assembles his orders. He ships small orders via Federal Express and large orders on commercial airlines. He does about $1,000 a week in business.
<Wow! All from a days diving? Great!>
Catalog of catches
The industry catches millions of fish and invertebrates in Florida every year. In 2002, the trade included 29,815 angelfish, 19,273 damselfish, 8,490 surgeonfish and 18,095 wrasses, among many other species, according the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission.
<What? Is this the new math? Where are the millions coming from? Not the above figures, plus other species collected in FLA...>
While no one knows whether the aquarium trade has caused any species to decline, divers and government officials say there appear to be fewer of these fish in Florida waters.
<Appear? Is this science?>
"My gut feeling is that some of these species numbers are down," said Billy Causey, superintendent of the Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary, who used to catch fish for the aquarium trade.
<What? A gut feeling?>
Causey and other experts say the drop in numbers could have many causes besides fishing for the aquarium trade, such as pollution, overfishing generally and global warming.
<Sure>
"The blame lies with what we have done to the ocean," Causey said.
<Not necessarily>
Formal stock assessments have not been made for any species captured for aquariums, which means no one knows whether the current level of fishing is sustainable. That lack of information is precisely why many fishermen are pressing for restrictions.
<Should be based on science... stock assessments, monitoring...>
"There's no science on this fishery," said Nedimyer, chairman of the Florida Marine Life Association, which represents people who catch the fish. "Nobody really has a clue how many fish are out there. There's a handful of us trying to be managers, trying to help the state do the right thing."
90%-plus survival rate
The vast majority of fish that are caught survive the trip to the pet shop, according to people in the industry. Nedimyer said his survival rate easily exceeds 90 percent. When he loses fish, it's generally because a flight delay leaves the fish in an area that's too hot or too cold, he said.
<Yes... or we'd all go broke>
Some environmentalists object to the use of the anesthetic Quinaldine to catch fish, saying it harms nearby fish and coral reefs. Animal-rights groups oppose the trade in principle, saying it's wrong to confine fish that haven't been raised in captivity.
<Not collaterally harmful>
"We don't think life in an aquarium for a wild-caught fish is what you want to see," said Richard Farinato, director of captive protection for the Humane Society of the United States.
The effort to restrict the aquarium-fish trade began several years ago. Concerned when the number of permits rose past 700, the state wildlife commission in 1998 imposed a moratorium on new permits. Even though only a fourth of permit holders actually caught any fish, the commission was concerned that the dormant permits could suddenly come into use.
The moratorium expires next year, and the commission now is trying to establish rules that would permanently hold down the number of permits.
Causey said the restrictions will help drive out the amateurs, who hold fish in garbage cans, put incompatible fish together or put big fish in a position to kill small fish.
<Uhh, what about fisherfolk? They take several orders of magnitude more biomass from the sea? Hello?>
"It is critical that you have people that are professionals all the way," Causey said. "It will definitely weed out those that are not serious about it."
Copyright (c) 2004, Chicago Tribune
<You'll be next. Bob Fenner>

A damsel/fish problem
In my marine biology class, we recently got 4 blue damsels, 1 yellow tailed damsel, and 2 4-striped damsels in. They were distributed blue blues to each tank, the yellow in one, and the striped in the other. Within a few days one blue damsel in each tank got the "lockjaw" that I have been investigating. They were each in separate environments for about 2 to 5 days, so I don't think it has to do with the environment, and it hadn't injured itself on anything. Both fish had died by the next day. We dissected one and nothing was stuck inside to prevent the mouth from closing. Today another blue fish has this same lockjaw, and we don't know what to do to cure it, if there is a cure. So unfortunately we assume it will be dead in the morning. Could you email me back with what you think the problem is and the solution, if there is one.
Thank You
-Paul Hooper
<Mmmm, don't know of this ailment "lock jaw" in Pomacentrids. Some do die shortly after arrival (all are wild-collected) with their mouths "stuck open"... perhaps a manifestation of these specimens inability to generate sufficient oxygen, or loss of osmotic integrity... consequent to poor, rough collection, shipping trauma. Fishes have very high (relative to terrestrial tetrapods) hematocrits (packed cell volumes) and live in a world/environment much less oxygen concentrated (at most about 7,8 ppm of O2)... and can have real troubles if the availability of oxygen drops, other influences to its uptake occur (e.g. drops in pH, elevated ammonia in shipping containers, slime wiped from their bodies...). Much more could be mentioned as possible sources of mortality, but I strongly suspect these anomalous losses are due to environmental stressors. Bob Fenner>

Becoming a Conscientious Collector (in Hawai'i)
Dear WWM Crew,
<Hi there>
First off I would like to say thank you for the wonderful site, the wonderful services your provide, and the great books by BF and AC. You guys have been a tremendous help and I truly appreciate the wonderful work you guys do!
<A pleasure to serve>
I currently have the opportunity to move to Kauai. We are in the initial stages of planning in buying land and having a house(s) built near Kapaa.
<A beautiful area. I spend a good deal of time in Hawai'i, own a house near Kona on the Big Island...>
The ability to have both land and home paid for would give us the flexibility in choosing our line of work. While I have years of experience in the computer industry, I am much more interested in continuing my education in aquariology and related sciences. I have spent years trying to find the "right" line of work and while snorkeling the thought came to me of "how can I do this for a living"?
<Can, though it is not "easy">
My questions revolve around the legality of collecting marine specimens for the trade in the Hawaiian Islands, where I might find some further resources in getting started as it relates to shipping procedures, QT of livestock before shipping to dealers, dealer contacts, etc.
<Contact the (DNR), Department of Natural Resources... and a few folks about... Randy Fernley of Coral Fish Hawai'i (on O'ahu)... I know collectors on the Big Island... there are such on O'ahu and Maui... none that I'm aware of on your island>
I have read through most of the FAQs in the business area but didn't see much info as it relates to collectors. Could you please point me in the right direction?
Thank you so kindly,
Jaime Knapp
<Jaime, do spend your time profitably, visiting with a few collectors... and learn "hands on" what all is involved. As stated above there are at least two, three "full-time" jobs here... running the boat, doing the actual diving (placing nets, driving fishes into them, catching them off the barrier/fence net...) knowing "the ropes" of where to get, make netting, catch baskets, how to best "decompress"/needle the catch, the actual techniques of using "chaser poles", other catch gear... AND building out, operating a holding system, paying appropriate attention to water quality (likely hauling large amounts of water)... AND doing sales and follow-up with the "A" players in the world who will buy (and pay) for your catch... AND making bags, buying boxes and cardboard liners, learning what size, species go in what size, shape bag, how to bag them... and having a crew (at least another person) to help. BEST and the only way I would/will proceed is for you to go and work with someone or two in the trade for a month or more... to live what is actually involved. I am very interested in realizing good people join the trade, and will gladly help you... Please make it known when you can visit the islands and I'll introduce you to people who know what to do, and are doing so. Bob Fenner>

Local Collections
Hi Guys,
<Slug>
I am very new to marine aquarium keeping, and after many months of research have recently begun my first 'setup'. My original goal is a DSB with plenum system, and mobs of live rock ala Tom Miller/Jaubert. I live in Darwin (tropical north of Australia), and as I scuba dive, my intention is to completely stock the tank with self collected rock and inverts (Aragonite Sand for the DSB will be my only 'purchase'!). While Darwin is blessed with magnificent offshore LPS, SPS, soft, Gorgonian and Sea whip forests and reefs, the conditions are quite unique, and far removed from for example the GBR. We have massive tidal movement (up to 8 meters!)
<Wowzah!>
and monsoonal downpours that make the water clarity 'very ordinary' (in diving terms 3 meters visibility is a good day here) and obviously restrict the amount of light reaching the reefs. Offshore underwater temperatures fluctuate between 18c and 33c in different seasons.
<A challenging environment to put it mildly>
Given that all my inhabitants are locally sourced and live naturally in these conditions, do you think it absolutely necessary that I have MH or VHO lighting
(I'm thinking I might get away with standard 40watt daylight & actinic fluoros),
<Should be fine>
and will the consequences be dire come 'hot season' when the tank's water temperature reaches 32/33c (given that my inverts inhabitants handle this 'in the wild') if I don't invest in a chiller?
<If not too drastic a change they should weather this as well>
Is there any need to 'cure' the live rock given that I bring it to the surface, immediately place it in plastic water filled tubs, and within a 15 minute boat trip it is sitting in my tank?
<Very likely no need for "curing" here>
(My understanding is that the curing process only pertains to LR purchased at retail and spending large amounts of time 'in transit' and therefore killing many critters on board).
<Yes>
Last question (I'm sure there will be many to follow!) - my original water ( and subsequent water changes) are also sourced 'from the wild' (we luckily have little or no pollution in Darwin). Should this partly negate the need to 'feed' the likes of SPS and Gorgonians given the fresh ongoing supply of plankton in the water?
<Right you are>
Hope I haven't 'outworn my welcome' with such a large War & Peace effort in my first correspondence - look forward to your valued advice,
Slug
<Thank you for sharing. Bob Fenner>

Postlarvae collect & growth as alternative to marine wild catch for aquarium trade
Dear Sir,
<Bonjour>
Ecocean is specialized in postlarvae collects in Polynesia. So as to expend our raised-tank stock list
I have 2 questions :
-Do you have producers address for bred marine fish (like ORA etc.) anywhere in the world.
<Yes. A brief listing of these companies can be found by reading here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/AqSciSubWebIndex/orncultart.htm  and through OFI's listing/member directory>
Also  we would like to implement a new fish farm in south east Asia (e.g. Philippines) do you happen to know 'classic 'fishermen for marine aquarium trade or aquaculture fish farmer with whom we could have a partnership for this nice alternative practice?
<I would contact Svein Fossa, Peter Rubec and Daniel Knop here. Am cc'ing them for their response to you. Both have extensive experience in the region and field>
We are also willing to develop the Development Aid action for local young people willing to stay in their island and protect it (training, restocking etc.).  More on ECOCEAN ? www.ecocean.fr
Waiting to hear from you, 
Sven-Michel Lourié
<Glad to make your acquaintance. Have read and heard many good things about your company and its programmes. Bob Fenner>
=====
ECOCEAN
80 Rue des Graves
34980 St Clement de Rivière
FRANCE
Tel/Fax : + 33 4 67 67 02 84
Cell : +33 6 18 39 82 80
www.ecocean.fr

Re: postlarvae collect & growth as alternative ...
Bob, 
I was told that the collectors capturing blue tang post-larvae target flat-top Acroporids and that they damage the corals during the collection process (personal communication, Mike King Coalition of Reef Lovers-CORL).  
<I had not heard/read of this... no need to damage the reef using this technique...> 
Since, hobbyists don't seem to care about coral reefs or the future of the trade, I will not be attending any of these meetings.
Peter Rubec
<Yikes... Peter, I assure you most all the hobbyists I'm familiar with care passionately re the world's reefs... attend some of the hobby conferences and am sure you'll agree. Bob Fenner> 

To Catch a Tang...
Hi Guys,
<Lyndon>
I'm hoping to a purple tang for my tank....The LFS doesn't sell em here but good news is that they are endemic to the UAE waters...I've seen schools of them when snorkeling and would like to know how to catch one of em for my tank....
<Please read through the marine collecting articles and FAQs indexed here: http://wetwebmedia.com/MarInd3of6.htm >
We don't have restrictions on reef fishing here as its evident from the number of Asfurs and Sohals that turn up dead at the Fish market for $2 a KG.
Thank You, Lyndon
<You'll need to buy or fashion a barrier/fence net... much else is detailed on WWM. Bob Fenner>

Collecting fish in Bahamas 
Bob, or whomever might be answering today. 
<Hello there> 
I'll be scuba diving /snorkeling in Bahamas (Man of War Caye, Abacos) in June, and would like to bring home a Royal Gramma for my tank. I've searched online for information regarding collecting ornamental fish in Bahamas, but have found conflicting information. Do you have experience/know where to point me to attempt to get permission to bring home 1 fish, which would not be for resale? 
<Good words to repeat at the point of going through airport security. Do contact the "fish and game" equivalent in the Bahamas re this matter... If it were me, I might also try finding a LFS there (for bagging, oxygen help) and ask if they might supply a receipt for you... Good hunting. Though plentiful where you find them, Gramma loreto is quick to avoid nets! Bob Fenner> 
Many thanks, Suzy

- Look What I Found... -
Dear Friend
I have caught the Conspicuous angel close to the Australian coastline and have observed the extremely rare and undescribed Ballina angel as well as other rare and endemic butterfly and angel fishes of Australia, do you know what the above are worth on the international market? <Both would be worth good money if you can get them to the end destination in good health. Would suggest you try to find a collector/shipper in your area and make arrangements with them to provide them with the livestock. Any moneys these fish can command will be limited by your economy of scale and shipping fish in one-zies and two-zies. Regards, Wayne
<Cheers, J -- >

A word about collecting your own: don't (please) 4/6/04 
I am going down to emerald isle, NC this weekend to do some fishing and relaxing....I was wondering if it would hurt my tank if I was to go down to the jetty and take 5 or 10 hermit crabs and put them in my tank? 
<yes> 
is there a difference? 
<yes... animals from temperate waters (the coast) versus tropical (your tank). Beyond that, the likely lack of QT risks the introduction of parasites, pests or diseases that are more tolerant of the change to warmer water than any inverts or fishes collected from there for ill-fated tropical aquaria> 
is it legal? 
<probably, but you should consult the local/state game commission. Anyone with a fishing license... the state website, etc> 
has anyone ever done this? 
<yes... and they perish - abbreviated lives (the collected, not the collectors)> 
will they eventually eat corals? 
<likely, yes... crabs are opportunistic predators. Very few are truly reef safe> 
I know that usually you want blue legs in a tank.... 
<actually no... while they are popular, they are not necessarily ideal for reef aquaria. For tanks with live sand/substrates, hermit crabs are a net burden on desirable life forms (they ravage the infauna in sand and rock). There are much better choices of detritivores for these tanks then crabs (best for FO displays instead). Anthony>

Wild Caught fish, Clown rashes
Hi,
<Hi there, Magnus here.  sorry for the delay in response.>
I have a 1" saddleback together with a puffer fish on a tank filled with sea water for two weeks now.  I've been maintaining self sustaining freshwater ponds way back in 1999 and decided to stop due to hectic sched.
<I know that exact feeling!>
Anyway, these two were given to me as a present by a friend who just arrived from a diving vacation.  This raised my desire to do fishkeeping again.
<You picked some great fish to get back into the hobby.  Puffers are extremely personable fish!>
These marines were originally transported in a 5-gallon container (a prison) filled with sea sand, a few corals and sea water (their natural
environment).  Quite a convincing present.
<quite an interesting gift! I wouldn't mind getting something like that for a present.>
Right now, I am preparing the main tank where I could house them.  It sounds odd that the fish came first before the aquarium is done.  
<Not typically the way to have it done, but as long as you work, it should go okay.>
I just added an under-gravel filter to their prison to make life a bit comfortable.  I changed water last week to fresh sea water taken from a nearby island where they came from.  I only measure the SG from time to time assuming that natural sea water needs no pH, ammo, trites and trates monitoring.
<you are right, Sea Water is pretty much sea water.  just be careful where the water is collected.  Make sure not near any outlets, or docks were man made chemicals or wastes are in the water.  Can be dangerous for the fish in such a small area.>
Lately, I noticed that the saddleback is occasionally scratching its body on the filter tubes especially when I switch off the filter.
<Many fish in the ocean have skin parasites, it's probably something like that.  and the fish is rubbing on the objects to get the parasites off.>
I also noticed, that there are some very fine pink rashes on its white stripe near its head. I cant figure out if its an itch.
<The pink rashes are most likely bruising from the fishes rubbing. I would suggest adding some medicine to the water to help fight the parasites.  If you have any stores that carry Mardel medicines I suggest you pick up some Maracyn Tablets.  They should work well for curing the fish of external problems.>
Both are doin good on their appetite.  I am planning do some freshwater-Methylene Blue bath.  Would it do any good?
<I wouldn't use it, I'm nervous with Methylene blue  on puffers.  They are sensitive to that.  I would go with medicines designed for Salt Water fish.> Thank you.
Joebel J. Sorioso
<Good luck. -Magnus>

- Catching a Devilish Damsel -
WWM Team
My blue devil has turned very nasty now that he is an adult (even more so than what I was willing to except before buying him).  it's so bad some of my other fish will not come out of the live rock.  I really want to return him but I can't get to him with a net with all the LR I have.  I even tried rearranging the rock but he just picked up his old habits.  what can I do? <I'd try baiting a barbless hook - this actually works better than you might think.>
thanks, your site has really helped me with this great hobby for the past 2 years.
BTW, when does the second volume of the invert series come out? <Well, I'm not as in tune with the process on this book as I was on the last one, but I get the impression it should be ready sometime in the Summer, perhaps early Fall.>
Mark
<Cheers, J -- >

Costa Rica Collecting 
WWM Crew- 
<I say a greeting> 
I am going to be visiting Costa Rica for the first time in a couple of weeks. I have heard that I will love it! Anyway, have any of you been 
there and brought anything back with you (fish, hermits, cucumbers, sea stars, etc. - NOT coral)? 
<I have been there a few times but have never bought live animals back> 
Does the Costa Rican government have any restrictions on small amounts of livestock for personal use? 
<Mmm, I would have to "ask them"> 
I went to the Cook Islands last year, met Chip Boyle and brought quite a few fish back with me as well as the first blue Linckia that has ever lived. 
<I have visited with Chip and Alice in Roratonga as well. Very nice folks> 
I had no problems at all. BTW, used Kordon's breathable bags for most of the livestock - more than 24hrs in a bag with nothing but water and no losses (this included some ventralis Anthias)! I wish the industry would notice these bags - I have used them a lot in my travels and they 
always seem to work well. 
<Too much money, too small... too flimsy to be made larger> 
Also, do you know of any collectors in San Jose I could visit? Thanks in advance, 
<There are none as far as I'm aware... perhaps while you are there you can look into their existence... maybe try the Guanacaste area> 
John Boe 
<Bob Fenner>

- Stop Chasing that Fish Around... -
Please help... I'm in desperate need of your assistance.  The tang has ick and I can't get it out of the tank ,around and around we go.  I have a reef system and do water changes per your advise. What do I do?  I feel that I'm causing more stress to fish chasing him around than the ick. <You're quite right about that.> Got any ideas? <Yeah, but you may not like it. I think you need to drain the tank - not completely, but enough to remove one of the degrees of freedom your fish is accustomed to. I've had to do this myself, and it's not exactly fun but sometimes there just aren't many other options. Get hold of a 1" flexible hose or drain line and a couple of garbage cans - I had to use three... drain down the tank to a couple of inches, net the fish into a bucket and refill the tank. Treat the fish after the tank has been refilled. Make sure you get the one inch hose so that you can empty the tank quickly; it will be over before you know it.>
Valerie
<Cheers, J -- >

Fish collecting business
Hi,
I have been in search on information about a new business I have in mind and since I found your website I have been able to find a lot of valuable information. I will planning on starting a fish collecting business in west Africa. I know I am faced with a lot of challenges. My plan is to setup my facility, begin collection and have the facility running for a few months before I start sourcing wholesalers.
<Actually, I would start this last right now. A very good idea to "go to this step" now in determining who you will sell to, what they are willing to pay, how they want to and can be shipped to (airfreight carriers, CITES, Customs, forwarders...), concurrent with your giving them some idea of what you have available. It may well be that these same folks can/will help you in gathering tools, materials, maybe even personnel to build out your collecting station and gear for shipping livestock>
I am also thinking of breeding some of the local species and hoping that down the road I will be able to rely more on aquaculture for fish I supply.
<... this is an entirely different business... much time, facilities, many hours involved in making a go... Do you have partner/s in this endeavor already? You will need at least one if you intend to do both collecting and aquaculture, plus employees>
Well my question is a business like this still viable in today pet industry and would it be difficult to find wholesalers willing to buy.
<Depends on what you have, can get, the pricing AND airfreight cost and availability... and even if your country's government will allow it. Do you know of existing businesses of your type that are in operation currently? I strongly encourage your talking with, visiting them... even working with/for them for a while>
Is there any article that will answer some of the questions I might have.
Thanks
Dayjee
<Welcome to our industry. I can and will help you if you'd like. By answering your general queries, introducing you about to some of the players in international markets. At this point, do you have a good idea of what sorts of livestock you will have available, in what numbers (sustainably)... how you're going to hold and ship them... to which countries? Bob Fenner>

Re: fish collecting business
Hi Bob
Thanks for your response. I will appreciate any help I can get. I intend to
sell a wide range of freshwater species (cichlids, catfish, killifish, barbs,
Mormyrids Distichodus etc.). I still need to gather my information on the
logistics but I guess the best way will be directly contact the wholesalers as you
suggested.
<Yes>
I have a lot of experience in various aspects of fish keeping. It
will be very nice to get some help building my collection station but knowing
that I have established a ready market will be a big motivation.
<Agreed>
I am pretty comfortable with putting together a station having worked on and
built several custom systems. My intention is to start with a 2000 gallon
holding system excluding quarantine and hospital tanks and leaving room for growth
and expansion. I am currently based in the US so I intend to concentrate on the
American market for now to allow better supervision. I am not sure of what
numbers  I will be able to hold at present. I intend to have about 500gallons in
2-5gallon holding tanks and the rest of the tanks ranging for 10- 200gallons.
I Also hope to setup a few large concrete tanks
I am not ready for aquaculture at present but I always wondered why with the
ease of breeding certain fish species there is not more emphasis on
aquaculture of aquarium fish.
<That eventually comes vis a vis economic incentives with all species>
I guess with more education I will understand why. I spoke
to a friend who has several ponds setup for catfish which he sells for about
$1 after six month for food. I believe that this space could be better used
for aquarium fish culture.
I look forward to getting some help from you with a few people I could talk
to.
Thanks
Dayjee
<Real good. I will be here. Bob Fenner>

Cutting Tang Spurs
Good day.
This is the first time I have written you with a question so please forgive if I am breaking any cardinal rules. By the way, great site. Lip service aside, I will keep my first question to you brief.
<Okay. Fire away>
Is the practice of cutting the "spurs" off of tangs at all inhumane in order to prevent them from injuring other fish and is there a right and wrong way to go about doing this? (How short does it need to be cut and will it grow back?)
Thanks in advance,
Kelly
<Good question (at least it is inspiring thought in this responder... who has cut back many "tangs" in the process of Acanthurid collection in the wild). I don't consider it "reasonable" to snip these sharp caudal peduncle processes in captivity for the purpose you mention... Too much damage, too little gain... and they "do grow back" quite quickly (weeks to a few months). The only practical "clipping" rationale is to prevent damage to the collector, other fishes in holding through the "chain of custody" to e/retailers IMO... There are two principal technologies employed to snip back either the movable or permanently extended spurs of the family... My fave is the use of large, sharp/newer "fingernail clippers", and the other is the use of specialized scissors used ostensibly for the same purpose. Each fish is held firmly with thumb on one side, other fingers of the same hand facing along the top, toward the back (to keep the sharp dorsal fin spines down, prevent the specimen from "wiggling free", with the fish out of water (except some larger Naso species are clipped underwater... as they can be dangerous in the meanwhile in the decompression bucket), and the spines snipped near their base (an eighth or so of an inch back from the "quick/origin"). Bob Fenner>

Belize
Dear Mr. Fenner,
         I hope that this gets through to you withy this address.
<Yes. Hello>
         I am a Canadian who has been involved in importing and
distributing marine fish and organisms for many years in a relatively
small way. I have also done some collecting in the Caribbean, again in a
small way, usually while visiting with a supplier.
<A way I like to spend time, get to know folks as well>
      As I near retirement age, I have an interest in doing more
collecting on a small commercial basis and export to several regular
customers. I have  been looking   at Belize as an option, and through
gleanings from wetwebmedia, understand that you have been involved in the
Belize scene in the past. I would appreciate any comments or suggestions
that you may have with regards to the current and future situation, and
your opinion on the feasibility of involving myself in a small way.
<It's been a few years since my last visit there, but I do hope/trust Mr. Harry Reeves is still about and at the collection/export of marine livestock still. Do inquire of him if/when contacting fisheries folks there re the possibility of joining the trade. Five years back or so there were only three license holders involved in ornamental aquatics... and not that much at that... with a HUGE resource (second largest barrier reef on this planet)... and MUCH good work done by Canadians there... roads, land surveyed, a good deal of "snow bird" population...>
        I understand that there is at least one organization operating
there and am told that there are many restrictions regarding quotas,
permits etc. and I am sure that there are logistical problems as well .
<We visited with the fisheries/resource management agencies in Belize City re these issues... not insurmountable>
       I would welcome any input that you may have, and look foreword to
your response. Keep up the good work that you and the crew are doing.
                                                     Respectfully, Grant
Armstrong
<Really, not just best, but only way of making progress on information, permits... and gaining insight as to whether you're going to like living there (a very nice, civilized place except for the old capital and San Pedro on Ambergris IMO) is to go there, stay a few weeks. Bob Fenner>

Sohal tang and hook
Thanks for your response. We tried to get him out with a small barbless hook
with a piece of shrimp on it. Sure it worked, but the worst happened. He
pulled the hook off the line.<you must of not tied a correct fisherman's knot lol>
He immediately went to the back of the rock.
It looked like from the front of the tank that the hook was sticking out his
cheek about a half inch back from his mouth.<ewww...it will rust off eventually. or it should>
A few minutes later he was back
out swimming around with no hook showing. He had a little tear on the top
inside of his lip.<should heal> What are the odds that he was able to spit it out or
would he have swallowed it? What would be the repercussions if he swallowed
it?<it will eventually rust> Would I have to worry about such a small hook being in the water with my
size tank if he did spit it out?<I doubt it> I have a pretty open area behind the rock
to look in the sand and I looked for a long time and haven't been able to
find it in the sand. I appreciate your help again, Thanks Ian <I would just continue to try to
capture the little bugger, I wouldn't be too concerned about the hook, IanB>

Collecting large fish
I may have the opportunity to go on a collecting trip later this year.  I am interested in collecting some various small fish and hopefully about 3 or 4 medium/large fish (12-20") for a quite large aquarium I have.   The small fish shouldn't be a problem, but I'm concerned about the larger ones.   It may be difficult for me to fast the fish prior to transporting them.   The
transport time shouldn't exceed a 30 hour drive.   I have a few ideas on transporting, but I need to get some idea of how much waste these fish will produce.
<Depends on species mostly...>
I can either box/bag them up individually or bring a 75gal portable tank.
<I would move them in large "coolers", in the dark>
My idea is to put the three large fish together and either run a power head or inject pure 02 if need be.
<Look into car-battery (12 v) continuous duty air pumps... and incorporate ammonia-absorbing media in the system/s>
I would also test the water every few hours and add Amquel to keep the ammonia under control.
<Amquel by itself will not sequester enough of the ammonia. Count on at least one good (50% percent) water change, and haul the water with you>
If I split them up I won't be able to use the powerhead/02 setup.
<If you use pressurized oxygen, make sure to vent the car... dangerous>
Maybe I should also plan on adjusting the pH and doing a partial water change along the way.
<Yes. Simple sodium bicarbonate will do as a buffer>
Any suggestions or comments would be helpful.  I have found a great deal of info on transporting fish, but with the larger fish it seems like it will be much harder.
<It is, but is done every day (mainly for public aquariums and large private systems. Bob Fenner>
john

Collecting Large Fish II - 8/11/03
Thanks for the fast response.  
<Anthony Calfo with the follow-up... Bob's away in Indo for several weeks>
Your thoughts are pretty much in line with what I was thinking.  You mentioned a ammonia absorbing media.  Can you suggest anything?  The only media I have found can only work in freshwater.
<I do believe he was referring to zeolite>
I have moved large fish before, but never this distance.  I usually run an inverter and air pump/stone for my several hour moves.  This would definitely be much easier than running an oxygen reactor and injecting pure 02, but in the confined space I am fearing that my DO will be too low for that length of travel time. John
<if the species you are moving are not sensitive to organic dyes... do consider adding a small amount of Methylene blue to increase O2 solubility/uptake and act as a mild anti-microbial. Best regards, Anthony>

Catching fish in a reef tank (8-6-03)
Ok... I'm clueless on this one... are there any tricks for taking fish out of a reef tank?
It seems to be impossible to catch them with a net (90 gallon tank) as they always find a safe place...
then again I don't want to damage the corals and other things... is there any trick to this, or do I have to pull all my corals and live rock out of the tank to catch a fish? :-( <Try feeding then quickly put the net in to corner them if you haven’t already tried that.  Another trick that sometimes works is take a small BARBLESS hook with bait and go fishing in your aquarium.  Also try posting on one of the many marine message boards like the one on WWM or reefcentral.com and find out other peoples tricks.  Cody>
Thank you,
Luke

Extracting a Grouper
Kevin,
Any tips on getting the grouper out.
<If the fish is friendly enough to you, try a clear container to capture it. Other methods include using 2 nets (one held by another person), netting while feeding, and using a barbless hook. For a grouper, the barbless hook idea may work great! -Kevin>

Methods of capturing tropical fish under scrutiny By Alexander Lane NEWHOUSE NEWS SERVICE June 25, 2003
 "Finding Nemo," the hit Disney movie about a tropical fish desperate to escape from a dentist's aquarium, preaches against everything from overprotective fathers to boats with trawls that catch too many innocent by-swimmers. It also lectures the growing subculture of saltwater aquarium keepers. The movie portrays the capturing of fish and other creatures from coral reefs – the primary means of supplying saltwater aquariums – as cruel and destructive. In a terrifying scene, a diver nets young Nemo from his reef. The tiny clownfish winds up in a saltwater tank and meets Gill, a crusty old angelfish who was also born in the ocean. The two spend their time in the glass prison concocting elaborate escape schemes. "Since the reviews first started, that's all the reefers have been talking about," said Philip Levanda of Nutley, N.J., a 27-year-old engineer and coral reef keeper. Intentionally or not, Disney has dived into the hottest issue in the world of tropical fish-keeping. Pet stores are filled with fish, corals, anemones and other creatures ripped from depleted coral reefs, often after having been stunned by a squirt of cyanide. Reef-enthusiasts are trying to stem the practice. A Hawaii-based group is struggling to start a stamp-of-approval program for retailers who say their creatures have been tank-bred or "ethically captured." Nine-year-old Alexander Gould, the voice of Nemo, has signed on as the group's spokesman. As word spreads of the industry's destructive practices, some fish-keepers are swearing off mass-market pet stores, instead trading their own colorful coral fragments in clubs popping up across the country and seeking out eco-minded fish suppliers. "When I first started out, I didn't know about the cyanide and the depletion," Levanda said. "Lately, I've been watching who I buy from and where they're getting it from." Levanda said he trades with other expert hobbyists and buys from Internet providers who advertise ethical collection. Although the movie might help raise awareness about the environmental hazards of scavenging coral reefs for exotic fish, it also has generated interest in clownfish as lovable pets. "I kind of have the sense that kids want to set up an aquarium to have Nemo at home," said Fernando Nosratpour, an assistant curator of the Birch Aquarium at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography. At the Birch Aquarium, which has more than 35 fish exhibits, some fish are bred in captivity and others are captured in the wild. Nosratpour said Birch officials don't associate with anyone who captures fish in unethical ways, such as the cyanide squirt. A spokesman for Petco, the Sorrento Valley-based national pet-supply chain, said many people who want to buy clownfish don't understand the time, effort and money involved in caring for these saltwater fish. "It's not an impulse buy," spokesman Shawn Underwood said. He said most of the fish sold at Petco are bred in captivity. Petco buys some exotic saltwater fish from wholesalers who catch them in the wild. All of the company's clownfish are captive-bred in Florida. Aquarium-keeping has been around since the mid-1800s, but only in the past 12 years or so has the average home hobbyist been able to maintain a miniature coral reef. Advances in science's understanding of ocean chemistry have enabled anyone willing to spend several hundred dollars to create their own tropical ecosystem. Aquarium owners can buy rock chiseled off reefs from places such as Fiji, the Philippines and Indonesia that is crawling with bacteria to digest harmful nitrogen and turn it into oxygen. Hermit crabs and starfish scour the sand, filtering out fish waste, with mechanical protein skimmers taking up the slack. Powerful halogen lights feed photosynthetic corals. Aquarists treat their water with everything from synthetic salt to calcium supplements. Between equipment and creatures, experts say aquarium-keeping has exploded into a $500 million industry. Although statistics are not methodically compiled, about 10 million marine specimens were sold in U.S. pet stores at an average price of $10 in 1995, according to a survey by the American Marinelife Dealers Association. Coral reefs represent about 1 percent of the ocean, yet 25 percent of all marine species rely on them for some element of their life span, such as spawning or feeding. One area of Hawaii known as the Gold Coast – thanks to the schools of yellow tangs that once populated its reef, tinting the water the color of sunshine – lost nearly all of the graceful tropical fish, an aquarium favorite for their beauty and algae-eating skills. Corals themselves – tiny animals whose colonies can take the forms of everything from branching trees to pipe organs to neon-green brains – are relatively easy to propagate in captivity. Hobbyists can simply cut off a fragment of a friend's specimen, glue it to a rock and watch it grow. But many are broken off reefs and sold by stores. Tropical fish are more difficult to propagate. Despite major advances in the captive breeding of clownfish – the most popular aquarium fish – many fish larvae will not survive in captivity. Only about 2 percent of fish sold in pet stores are bred in captivity, according to the Hawaii-based Marine Aquarium Council. The council has created a certification program for nondestructive fish collectors, middlemen and retailers, but the effort is in its infancy. The group approves of collecting live fish, as long as it is done humanely drugs and does not exhaust the local population of a species. "The reality is this trade will be based on wild-caught fish for a long time to come. The need is to fix it," said Paul Holthus, the council's executive director. Some ardent reef watchers, such as environmental law professor Howard Latin of Rutgers University in New Jersey, believe the Marine Aquarium Council does not go far enough. "Like narcotics, it's never going to be solved by imposing measures in poor countries," Latin said. "The problem has to be solved by eliminating the demand or tolerance in larger countries, and the United States is by far the largest importer of aquarium fish."

Aquarium Trade practices
To Whom It May Concern:
<Hello Glen>
I have been looking around your site and have found some very interesting information regarding the aquarium trade. I have found some great information about the set-up of retail outlets but none on collecting methods, handling, storage and export procedures etc..
<We have a few general pieces posted on techniques. Take a read starting here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marcoll.htm
and look over the linked articles, FAQs (in blue, above) there>
I am in PNG and am about to begin collecting and trading marine aquaria and am looking to gain as much information as possible. I’ve emailed various people seeking information including the MAC ( who have been of no help) and still have not found much information.
<There are a couple of very dated, though useful printed works that detail S.O.Practices... but am very strong on suggesting you travel about, observe others in the trade for input here>
I am totally committed to sustainable practices and want to find out as much information as possible about practical implementations.
Any information you can help me with would be greatly appreciated.
Thank-you Glen Butler
<Will you build a holding facility there? Who is it you intend to ship to and through? Perhaps others in the trade can assist you as well. Am cc'ing Chris Buerner of Quality Marine here for his help as well. Bob Fenner>

Denver visit, cyanide use
Bob,
I was at your talk yesterday at Marine Showcase in Colorado and wanted to thank you for coming out, it was great and good job.
I wanted to ask you if you saw any improvements in the current situation with Cyanide or do you see it as something that is going to continue to hurt the
trade and ultimately put a stop to it.
<Much to say here... have thought, now for decades that such a self-defeating, destructive practice would be self-limiting... I do see the countries in Asia finally putting a stop to poison fish-collecting practices... much the same as folks in southern Africa nations are curtailing poaching in park/reserves... by extreme force. Who knows when such drastic means will take place, or how quickly/thoroughly they will abate such activity. Don't similarly know the damning effects of the various powers that be will have on the restriction of the trade... The hobby is such a minor influence, I don't think it bears notice compared with other more significant sources of mortality, issues>
Also, since you said you are out of the industry, what are you doing now?? Just curious.
<Oh, tax returns indicate I am a "content provider"... as far as involvement in our interest I write, sell pix, consult, give talks...>
Have a great week and thanks again.
John McCoy
<Thank you for writing, your kind words, and probing questions. Bob Fenner>

Tank Raised Or Wild Caught?  3/17/03
Hi,<Hey there!  Phil here!>
You might think this is a weird questions but anyhow it must not be the first time. I was wondering if a wild caught fish could be less happy or more prone to disease than a tank born and raised fish.< See here for more info... www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/aquaculture. tm & www.wetwebmedia.com/marcoll.htm >
Thanks<Hope this helps! Phil>

Gulf Angels
Bob:
<Howdy, morning>
I wanted to get your thoughts on this with regards to practicality,
methodology and even ethical considerations:
I reside in Pensacola, FL. Near the beach, and some of my SCUBA diving
buddies have become interested in my tank.  During one of their visits and
upon seeing my Rock Beauty proclaimed, "Hey, we have to shove those th9ings
away from us there's so many of them down there where we dive!"  To which I
replied, "Well that's about $100 worth of fish right there."  Well of course
what ensued was brainstorming as to how they could collect a few specimens
and sell them locally.  They also have seen Lionfish near Tampa Bay
supposedly.  Anyway, it would seem a simple thing to do to collect one or
two at a time and sell them for a decent price (setting up a dedicated
quarantine tank for this of course - not putting them in mine) thoughts?
<Well, a few things... the Rock Beauty doesn't sell as well as other Angels found there. Please see: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/bestmarangs.htm as it doesn't fare as well in captivity... and the "diver pay" for this species is only about ten dollars... and you'll need a place to "hold" them (individually) for a while. Please see here re capture  techniques: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/collmarsdvg.htm
and the linked files (in blue, above) re barrier and hand-net collection. You will likely need these tools... and licensing from the State. Bob Fenner>

Re: Gulf Angels
Bob:
"Licensing"? Aye, there's the rub.
<Agreed>
Well I guess a visit to the fisheries
commission is in order then.  By the way - further investigations have found
the Queen Angels are also really common here.  I wasn't aware there were
guidelines for "diver's pay" my friends would get the for free and just
expect some of the profits.